Clean It Up
UK Floor Cleaning Forum => Carpet Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: MAX Carpets on July 13, 2010, 12:58:55 pm
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Hi all
Just out of interest, is the Scorpian with clean & waste water tanks really as good as a Petrol/Diesal/LPG truck mount??
Cheers
Justin
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Make an educated guess Justin,
;)
In what respect are you referring to ?
Suction, psi, heat, ease of use, build quality, looks, simple answer imo NO.
price compared to tm been the only thing in its favour.
Out of interest , who has told you this? judging by your question it gives the impression that somebody has told you this.
geoff
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No one has said anything Geoff, just browsing sites. I am changing my Blazer into a new van and just thought This is a lot of hassle, so I was looking through at some of these so called porty's with TM performance. Scorpian looks good with the tanks. I didnt really think it would be that good, but thought I would ask.
Cheers
Justin
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I had a scorpion with tanks, worked very well, bit of a hassle with leccy cables,
but not too bad, had an inline heater, did excellent job.
Now have a truckmount, easier having no cables, plenty of heat, was it better than tm,
only just, used both today on same job, no difference in quality of work or dryness.
However i have only got an entry level tm, so it depends what you are comparing
it against.
Scorpion is 300psi tm is 800psi, often i run tm on 3/4 throttle, and have psi down to 200psi,
just depends what you are comparing against again.
Cost wise again are you comparing new scorp against second hand tm or vice versa.
Lots of different comparisons.
my opinion.
Andrew ( make my own decisions, not what i am told) :D
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I thought Scorpian was 500psi? Not that it matters, I never go above 400 with TM anyway. I am curious why all these porty manufactures claim TM perfomance?
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Hi Guys
Porty manufactureres claim TM performance to sell machines!
In reality one is restricted by the amount of energy a porty can get from the property electricity, an engine is restricted by it's power which is considerably more and therefore with a TM you get high heat, high pressure and high vacuum all at the same time.
Cheers
Doug
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the original scorpy was 300psi but its been 500psi for a few years now
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Hi all
Just out of interest, is the Scorpian with clean & waste water tanks really as good as a Petrol/Diesal/LPG truck mount??
Cheers
Justin
;D
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Derek, I think you're great and always so helpfu !
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;D
i do try em ;D
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You're my hero.
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Justin,
I have used the Sorpian on various jobs from clean domestic carpets to office carpets to night club carpets. As far as portables go it does perform well but put it next to a truckmount and you will tell the difference. Truckmounts are far easier to work with than portables as a general rule. Less hassle, higher performance.
Moving your Prochem Blazer into another van is not that difficult and is even easier if you have the new van parked up next to the van that the Blzer is already in.
Andrew,
Depending on which truckmount you have it is not wise to run at 3/4 throttle. On smaller truckmounts running them at less than full throttle especially whilst cleaning carpets can & will bog the engine down. If your truckmount is air cooled it really needs to run at full throttle which is how its been designed to ensure the engine is pulling the max amount of air into the cooling finns.
Richie.
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Thanks Richie
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Justin,
I have used the Sorpian on various jobs from clean domestic carpets to office carpets to night club carpets. As far as portables go it does perform well but put it next to a truckmount and you will tell the difference. Truckmounts are far easier to work with than portables as a general rule. Less hassle, higher performance.
Moving your Prochem Blazer into another van is not that difficult and is even easier if you have the new van parked up next to the van that the Blzer is already in.
Andrew,
Depending on which truckmount you have it is not wise to run at 3/4 throttle. On smaller truckmounts running them at less than full throttle especially whilst cleaning carpets can & will bog the engine down. If your truckmount is air cooled it really needs to run at full throttle which is how its been designed to ensure the engine is pulling the max amount of air into the cooling finns.
Richie.
I quite agree with you Richie, however when i am cleaning upholstery on full throttle
the heat it produces is exceptionally high, too hot, and pulls too much fabric into the hand tool.
Finding a happy balance can be difficult, infact i do have a slight prob with the tm and may call
you re: the 16 hp briggs you have, just waiting for my mate to pop round and do a compression test.
Andrew
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Like you Andrew, I am fortunate to be in the position of having what is arguably still the best best portable on the UK market - the 3 vac Scorpion (albeit like you I have the earlier 300psi model-not the later 500psi).
For upholstery I prefer to use the Scorpion over my Prowler for much the same reasons as you. Dont particularly want the high heat and with the Scorpion I can control it better, and reduce the suction if need be.
However I do have work arounds.
Do you not have CFR upholstery tools?? I have the 3" and the 5" and with both you can alter the air flow by uncovering holes which allows more air to flow - les suction at the point the lips are on the upholstery.
And for heat, the work round is I can divert water away from the solution hose back to the clean tank. This means I set the pressure at say 400 on the gauge, which is too much for the CFR tool.
I then open the diverter valve, which reduces the pressure to what I need, say 200-250, thus some of the water goes back to the clean tank. As water is flowing thro the heat exchanger faster it does not get as hot. I dont waste a lot of water and there is less heat at the tool.
I did a suite on Monday in this manner, mainly because the carpet was being cleaned afterwards.
If it had just been the suite i may have loaded the Scorpion (I dont normally carry it).
But going back to the original thread question.
Whilst the Scorpion is very good, it does not have the performance of my Prowler. Bear in mind the Prowler, possibly the cheapest of the truckmounts, is getting on for almost twice the price of the Scorpion.
However, I would not like to be without my Scorpion. A brilliant backup machine.
And whilst we have had reports on here in the last 12 months or so of vac motor and pump trouble on other makes of machines, the Scorpions seem to go on and on. Must be something not only in the choice of quality materials, but also the design.
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And not being used everyday
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Even being used everyday, as I do with mine as I do not have a truckmount like Joe, I use the Scorpion all the time. Got two and a half years out of the first set of vac motors. I have an older machine one of the original Recoils which I might use a few times a month but the Scorpion is my main machine.
I do not have the Auxiliary tanks as my work is mainly domestic ( my own choice), I like to switch the machine off now and again to fill a few buckets of water and have a chat with my customers.
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Ian,
I was making reference to Scorpions, as in more then one, more then mine.
Finton, and many others, use a Scorpion daily as their main machine, but dont seem to report problems like we have heard here on CIU from members who have bought even brand new machines and then within months a motor is playing up or having pump problems. Some reports read like a continuing horror story.
True, my machine does not get used every day now because I have the Prowler - but it used to.
The machine used to belong to Spencer Davis, remember Spencer used to post on here regularly. He used the machine a lot, and so did I prior to the Prowler.
As far as I can determine this machine of mine, probably just under 5 years old, has only had 1 replacement vac motor - and that was wholly my fault.
The pump is now causing a problem, but it is the original pump. I am hoping to fit a new 500psi pump soon, so when I sell the machine (when I retire) it will be up to spec and the pump will not have had a lot of use.
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The short answer to the question is a very emphatic, no!
The Scorpion is undoubtedly a very capable portable machine but it is not a Truck Mount and does not have Truck Mount performance, but may arguably have truck mount like performance which is not the same thing.
Even an entry level TM will out perform any electric powered machine purely because of the extra grunt you get from an engine as opposed to the power you can draw from even multiple 13 amp sockets.
The other great thing about a TM is perception - you open the side door of your van and there sits a gleaming chunk of high end technology that immediately impresses upon your client that you're a seriously player, (not that portable users aren't) but it's the perception it gives the client which to my mind is well worth the extra few K's they initially cost.
If anyone wants a shining example of how to start a successful carpet cleaning business from scratch with all the very best machinery then you need look no further than Derek West. I very much doubt he could have climbed as high as he has if he'd gone for the cheaper options, but I may be wrong, maybe someone with Derek's get up and go is bound to succeed just through force will.
Well done, Derek. Hats of to you, mate.
Simon
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is the Scorpian with clean & waste water tanks really as good as a Petrol/Diesal/LPG truck mount?
good at what? cleaning carpet & upholstery?........... then the truthful answer is yes....... just slower :-\ :-\
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The sad thing Simon, is that I started of with £21k cash, kindly donated to me by the Royal Navy for my knee injury....
If only I knew at that time that less than 12 miles away, sat HM, if only I had the knowledge that carpet cleaning forums existed and if only I stopped for one second, rang around for a good carpet cleaner in our area (Goran or Neil for instance) to clean our carpets to see how they do it, things could be so much different now. This was all 2 years ago :-[
My advice will always be, "Buy the BEST you can afford!" My custy's are always astounded by the machine, which means they DO take notice of what you're using! And I don't think anyone can ever expect to win an argument that our porty's match up to the power of the TM....
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Colin,
You'll get there in the end, you've get the metal ;)
Simon
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Thank you Simon... That means a lot :)
Colin
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Colin,
Anyone who is prepared to clean ovens to keep their business going has my admiration because it is the people who will do whatever it takes to succeed that in the end do succeed and you're one of those people. I started my business career (35 years ago) delivering milk for my father-in-law and decided to start my own round at the same time. I started with one customer and built it up from scratch till I had 400 customers. I then started carpet cleaning part time and slowly and painfully built it up. I always wanted to do large commercials and low and behold I now have a job I could not have dreamed of. When I look back at all the things I did along the way to keep going when times were tough ( and there were plenty of those times) it makes me realise that I always was going to succeed, it was only ever a question of time and opportunity.
You have that same metal and I admire you immensely for it, so no matter how tough things get, you've got to keep going because if you do you WILL succeed.
If you fancy a day in Southampton you can come and have a look at one of our ships being cleaned, that will either inspire you or put you off carpet cleaning for good. ;D
I know you've got it tough at the moment so if there is anything I can do to help: simon@gerrardscarpetcleaners.co.uk
Simon
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Well said Simon! Too many people (not you Colin) think this business is easy to start up! I would say the complete opposite. I, like you Simon have made so many mistakes since starting in 1988 I'm surprised I'm still alive, let alone trading! To build up a good solid customer base is very hard, draining and stressful to say the least. Well done to all that succeed!
Is the invitation to see your ships open to anyone??
Justin