Clean It Up
UK Window Cleaning Forum => Window Cleaning Forum => Topic started by: Matthew JN on June 10, 2010, 03:49:50 pm
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Hi all
Had a prospect customer who has a sizable detached property with conservatory. Last summer i had quoted her £30 to do a regular clean every 7-8 weeks for outside excluding conservatory roof. She dithered around so much making a decision i just thought she was a time waster.
Anyway got an email from her a week ago asking when i could come and do the windows, and at this present time my rounds are now all where i want them and am not taking on any more regular round work - only larger one-off jobs or quarterly contracts.
So i emailed her back and told her all i could offer her would be a one-off job for outsides and insides including conservatory roof (and inside of roof) for £180.00.
She replied saying she thought it was far to much and her husband reckoned i could complete 3 of the same jobs in a day - and that would put my earnings at £130K per annum JUST for cleaning windows.
How stupid and rude can you be ???
Don't need morons like that do we.
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lol so what if you are on 130k good luck to you m8
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The worst one I had was a woman leaving a message to the effect "you will be earning £20 p/h at that price, I don't even earn that much and I'm a legal secretary".
Out of interest, how long would the £180 job have taken you?
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She replied saying she thought it was far to much and her husband reckoned i could complete 3 of the same jobs in a day - and that would put my earnings at £130K per annum JUST for cleaning windows.
You should reply and say that her husband has it all wrong, and that you do 3 of the same jobs by lunch time.
;)
Andy
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I would do something similar to what Andy says.......e-mail her back saying you actually earn 160k a year and thank her for pointing out you had underpriced her job and the price is now ;£225.00 ;D
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"you will be earning £20 p/h at that price, I don't even earn that much and I'm a legal secretary".
Id reply to this with,
'I wouldnt even get out of bed for that, Ive got standards Im not a carpet cleaner you know!'
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;D
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you could reply that if her husband can find you 3 of those jobs every day you will give him the 30k to make it a round number ;D
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"Perhaps your husband might like to get off his fat derriere and do it himself?"
;D ;D ;D
Love the replies guys!
I had a long term pita custy last week (after me dropping her over her attitude and her writing to ask why) tell me in writing she was "stunned" at my price of £20 to do her conny roof! (Small lean-to type as a favour)
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For the record i priced the job at a full days labour (for me £180) and i reckoned seeing as the windows are old and some leaded that i would need pretty much a full day to complete, what with the conservatory and that.
If you wanna see the reply email i sent here it is>>>
Mihela,
I feel sorry for you and your husband that you feel the need to try and belittle me and the window cleaning industry. Just because I quoted you a professional price for what would have been a professional job.
What a stupid assumption there ! Ah well all the better for me that I earn £130k per year which is clearly more than your husband earns as you have said he can only afford to pay peanuts.
I work very hard for what I earn and most of it goes to pay for treatment for my severely disabled son who has autism and cannot speak yet at the age of 5 years old.
Best you both go and find a monkey then – as they love peanuts all day long. After all it’s ONLY cleaning windows – and you seem to think that window cleaners do not deserve to be earning very much money. Maybe you see anyone who runs a window cleaning business as a bottom feeder ? or perhaps you feel you are both way above window cleaning in your chosen professions.
You are both pathetic and need to grow up. If you want your windows cleaned by any professional. I suggest you both need to change your attitude towards how you do business with them and stop acting like a couple of snobby morons who think they know it all.
No need to reply – I think the buck stops with you.
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I agree that some customers have no idea regarding how much it actually costs us to run our buisinessess in the correct manner.
However I dont think your email to customer was very professional.
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Brilliant, I have copied and pasted into a similar email, would i like to see the face when they open it.... well done
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It won't help to enhance peoples perception of window cleaners by sending abusive emails and only serves to bring you down to their level. Personally I would have just ignored the letter. Move onwards and upwards.
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I agree that some customers have no idea regarding how much it actually costs us to run our buisinessess in the correct manner.
However I dont think your email to customer was very professional.
So glad that I'm not the only one. I totally agree with Steve. Although I understand the anger you must have felt, However, I would have let the matter drop, you gave your price, they refused end of - their loss. In this business word of mouth is everything and it only takes something like this to leak out and your reputation is ruined.
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Steve you may think the email was unprofessional and it was meant to be. No need to get nervous about her ruining my reputation as a have a solid base of round customers who i treat in a professional and courteous manner, most of whom i'm sure if i showed them the email they would have been in agreement with me.
I have swallowed peoples crap in the past and it doesn't feel good. After all that's one of the good aspects of working for ourselves, so we don't have to put up with peoples crap if we don't want to.
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It's good that you have a good solid base of customers. So whats the worry? I still say move on and forget about it. Also be careful as the lady in question may have friends / relatives who you also clean windows for - you don't want to lose these people as customers do you?
When I have a quote rejected I feel the satisfaction of knowing that this wasn't the right customer for me. Concentrate on quality custom only (like you seem to be doing already) as the ones who aren't willing to pay the price can find some mug who is willing to work for peanuts!
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Once again I agree with Steve. Also, I'm glad you explained that it was meant to be an unprofesional email otherwise some of the newbies reading might have thought it was acceptable and although I'm glad your reputation is solid, theirs might not be.
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goodnight :)
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A simple "no problem" email wouldve annoyed them more. I personally wouldnt of replied like you, as said before i understand how you feel, but no point getting in a tis about it all, just turns into a battle of words, i wouldnt be surprised if she replies with something to rattle you a little more then youll reply again...where does it end? Like i said, reply with "no problem, thanks" what can they say to that?
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For the record i priced the job at a full days labour (for me £180) and i reckoned seeing as the windows are old and some leaded that i would need pretty much a full day to complete, what with the conservatory and that.
If you wanna see the reply email i sent here it is>>>
Mihela,
I feel sorry for you and your husband that you feel the need to try and belittle me and the window cleaning industry. Just because I quoted you a professional price for what would have been a professional job.
What a stupid assumption there ! Ah well all the better for me that I earn £130k per year which is clearly more than your husband earns as you have said he can only afford to pay peanuts.
I work very hard for what I earn and most of it goes to pay for treatment for my severely disabled son who has autism and cannot speak yet at the age of 5 years old.
Best you both go and find a monkey then – as they love peanuts all day long. After all it’s ONLY cleaning windows – and you seem to think that window cleaners do not deserve to be earning very much money. Maybe you see anyone who runs a window cleaning business as a bottom feeder ? or perhaps you feel you are both way above window cleaning in your chosen professions.
You are both pathetic and need to grow up. If you want your windows cleaned by any professional. I suggest you both need to change your attitude towards how you do business with them and stop acting like a couple of snobby morons who think they know it all.
No need to reply – I think the buck stops with you.
Bad move IMO - but understandable.
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what a joker,
never would i send something like that,
just goes to show you are not very professional as you think you are.
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i bleve you should get yer own back, dont be a mouse -be sure to put a block on her email address tho, so its you who has the last laff . might seem childish but we are all kids really !!
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I don’t agree at all with sending a letter like that, it totally undermined and contradicted itself,
In it you are explaining how you are a professional therefore charge accordingly, yet you say it in a childish, abusive and very unprofessional way.
I fully understand how you must have felt and see no reason why you should not have replied, but in my opinion if it had been done eloquently and in a polite and professional way the impact could have been huge.
Instead they will read that and say to themselves and others, "see, what a bunch of morons these window cleaners are"
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Oh dear.
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Personally I'd have added her to my books in the first place; surely you could have fitted one more clean in every two months ::) ??? ::)
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Unprofessional reply or not! It should not have been sent, It takes nothing for her to forward this onto hundreds. Sorry mate, but you called her "rude" and "stupid" and then promptly lowered yourself to being the same. ???
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Personally I'd have added her to my books in the first place; surely you could have fitted one more clean in every two months ::) ??? ::)
Quite so and the had the"extras" on the con roof etc etc aswell, which would have worked out more income, over the year
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No I wouldn't of handled the situation like that. I wouldn't of replied to her email and would of left it and moved on. You can damage your rep by lowering yourself to squabling with customers or ex-customers.
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i bet matthew wishes he never put this post up now,
has dell would say "rodney you ponker"
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Matthew, with hindsight what are your thoughts on this one? I know it's a difficult one for you to answer but are you still happy with your actions?
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Here's one I did after deciding to drop a PITA customer:-
Mrs XXXX
XX Southwood Drive
Coombe Dingle
Bristol
BSXX
4th June 2010
Dear Mrs. XXXX,
I am replying to your letter of the 2nd of June and responding to the points you have made.
Firstly my recollection of events is rather different to yours and I will start specifically with the day in question but also go back to the previous month’s visit to clean your windows too.
When I made my comments about you not fitting the profile of the customer I wish to keep I meant that I wish to keep regular, reliable customers who, when wanting changes to the regular agreed work give reasonable notice and do not “drop it” on me at the point of arrival; also those that appreciate that the only way for me to make a sensible living from my work is to have it scheduled efficiently so that I can fill my day to its maximum workload without unnecessary changes. It is challenging enough to schedule around pre-planned changes and unpredictable weather without the attendant domino effect of making changes on the spot.
I think upon reflection that you will realise that your interpretation of “profile”, expressed in your letter, is not a true representation of my meaning.
Moving onto our conversation on Wednesday; what I said, but obviously didn’t make clear to you was that I would only charge £4 for the previous month “... as I only cleaned the front four windows and that the bulk of the work is at the back with the conservatory.”
The “clean” this time would have been £18 and the roof £20, totalling £42 including the £4 from last time. Rather less than the £48 quoted in your letter. Also as the conservatory had not been done for two months then extra dust, hairs and mud associated with your dogs would have been included in this price.
Page 2
To your being “stunned” at the quoted £20 for the roof; conservatory roofs do not respond to a “quick brush over” if they have not been cleaned for many months as there is the usual detritus of birds’ droppings and moss along with algae and the results of what has been an exceptionally dusty few months, perhaps associated with the ongoing volcanic activity. (Maybe you have noticed that your car has needed cleaning more often?) This entails using a different brush with stiffer bristles and cleaning fluids and attendant extra time.
However, my deciding to terminate my cleaning for you has its roots in events starting last month. You were not home and so I started cleaning the front of your property and you arrived – not seeming particularly pleased to see me – and asked me to not clean the back and to do a more thorough clean of the conservatory including some of the insides “next week”. I adjusted my schedule for this. I then received a phone call saying to leave it until the next month which I did. When I arrived, the parameters were changed yet again by you and now I was asked to do the outside of the conservatory roof only – along with my regular cleaning.
To then have you baulk at £20 to clean the conservatory roof which by its very nature will include the gutter outsides as well was, frankly, the final straw. I hope this gives a more comprehensive answer as to why I acted as I did.
Finally, please find enclosed your cheque to me for which I thank you but your debt is only £4.00 which as I said at the time I am happy to write off.
Thank you for your comments about my work and I wish you all the best for the future.
Yours sincerely,
Malcolm Gold
M. Gold Window Cleaning
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Do you really go to the effort to do all this?
Just move on and forget.
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I had a customer a couple of years back, only ever saw them once when I did the quote. I used to go round clean the windows leave an envelope and the cheque came through within a few days good as gold.
One day I went there and there were two guys concreting in a base for a big conservatory at the back. I cleaned as usual but made a mental note to talk to them which I didn't do.
Next time I went back there was a big conservatory. The windows on it were pretty much clean anyway so I did the other windows, splashed some water around on the conservatory windows and left a bill for the usual amount but made a note on my sheet that I really would have to talk to them before the next time.
Anyway the cheque never arrived so about a week later my wife phoned them to give them a nudge. The woman was really stroppy, she wasn't paying because the roof of the conservatory was still filthy.
All attempts to explain that the conservatory was new and had never been included in the original quote and anyway conservatory roofs are time consuming and are quoted for seperately fell on totally deaf ears. She wasn't paying and that was that. Her view that the roof would be about £30 to clean was "ridiculous"
So we dropped her, never got paid, am I bothered? No! Life is too short, just move on and forget them. Never get involved.
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>Sensai LWC -
With the one I mentioned above - I had received a polite but in my opinion inaccurate and misinformed letter from my ex customer and a cheque from her and so felt it was courteous to respond by the same medium.
And it's no bother - maybe thirty minutes one evening - and what with me being an insecure guy underneath all the bluster it makes me feel better! ;)
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Not exactly the same situation, but here is a letter I sent to a snobby (ex) customer after having put up with several inconsiderate incidents:
In accordance with your initial request for our service and your specific instructions regarding procedure, we have cleaned your windows on three occasions (15/12/08, 27/2/09 and 30/4/09)
Prior to each visit we informed you two days in advance of our intention, as you required. At the time of the second visit you requested that we clean the greenhouse the next time we visited, and although I gave you a full written quotation you disputed the agreed cost.
When my franchisee, Mr Stephen Shaw visited on the 30th of April (the third visit) you declined to have the greenhouse cleaned despite your previous request and deferred the clean until the next time.
When the next scheduled visit became due Mr Shaw attempted to contact you, and getting no reply he left a message advising you of his intention to clean your windows two days subsequent to the date of the telephone message.
When he arrived at your property he was informed that ‘it was not convenient to clean the windows’. As he had fulfilled all your requirements regarding procedure he was understandably upset by having incurred a wasted journey and the costs of fuel and lost time when he could have been working elsewhere. If his proposed visit was not acceptable, then common decency dictates that he should have been informed, and an alternative arrangement suggested. Even in the event that you did not receive his message in time, the least you ought to have done is apologise for the inconvenience and request an alternative visit.
As you seem to hold us and our service in such low esteem I have cancelled our arrangement and replaced you with more appreciative customers.
Yours sincerely,
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I had a rude e-mail from a customer yesterday and just e-mailed her back and told her we didn't agree with her version of events and therefore felt that the arrangement was best ended. Shouldn't have touched it in the first place - she wanted references from us and put us on a 3 month trial!! Drop em and forget about em!
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Nothing gives me more pleasure than to drop the 'pain in the asse' customers but they just get a brief call or email and I move on.
I appreciate that many of you feel better by sending a letter explaining your side of events and I applaud those of you who can do so in a polite manner
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It's good that you have a decent customer base, but, how did your potential customer get to know about you in the first place? Was it from a personal recommendation from one of your regular customers? Were you seen doing a neighbour's windows?
Whatever the case may be, I feel that your attitude may well come back to bite you if she knows any of your customers.
It seems to me that if you treat them with respect and dignity, your reputation will always grow in a positive way. Treat them like that outlined in your email, and ask yourself how you would expect to be regarded.
John.
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Treat them with respect of coarse but not all of them are going to treat you the same way. Thats just life. Some are nasty people, others a bit mad, others I think just need to get out more.
Whatever, keep the good ones and let the others go. Thats how you build your round. I'm certainly not going to start writing them letters, life is too short for that.
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Sending shirty e-mails to shirty customers will just give them the moral highground. They'll think, "Well then, we were right about that dodgy rude window cleaner", then put your letter/e-mail in the bin.
Kill them with kindness, and remember that humility is the best form of superiority!
Gold's letter is very good!
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humility is the best form of superiority!
Umm, it is? ??? ???
Sounds like a contradiction in terms.
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Hi all,
Just got back of holidays - i was amazed at the response this has provoked.
Yes i had time to mull it over while on a break and guess what ?? when i got back there was a reply in my inbox - saying she was sorry that she inadvertantly upset me !
But with hindsight i wouldn't repeat this - only that she had been ping me around for last 12 months.
But move onwards and upwards and be better for the experience eh ?
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humility is the best form of superiority!
Umm, it is? ??? ???
Sounds like a contradiction in terms.
You can be humble in such a manner that it's a form of superiority. I can act more humble than you, and in my head, I could think I am better person than you, because I am more humble.
I can be more spiritual than you, and also think I am a better person, because of my level of spirituality.
I can also believe I'm more intelligent than you, because I understand stuff you don't! ;D
The ego is a funny thing.
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;)
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I have been reading these letters sent out to 'rude' customers. I feel that this is a very bad area to get into, as, for myself, most of my work comes through word of mouth, and the fact that I am seen all the time in the area. I have had my share of rude and ignorant customers, but have dropped them as 'quietly' as I can.
Usually, if I am asked to do anything extra that is big, I try to leave it 'til next time, saying that I haven't really got the time now (as I have phoned several customers, and they will be expecting me at such and such time time), and I will make a note and will be able to allow the time next time. I even do this with new customers, unless it's a small job. I recently put my prices up, where-upon this woman said "what for, it's only a ladder and a bucket of water". they're just not worth bothering with, and I certainly wouldn't write letters or emails.
I was in a job once where rudeness and abuse was given regularly, and was sent on a course to deal with it. So remember this next time... The problem lies with them.
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Sending shirty e-mails to shirty customers will just give them the moral highground. They'll think, "Well then, we were right about that dodgy rude window cleaner", then put your letter/e-mail in the bin.
Kill them with kindness, and remember that humility is the best form of superiority!
Gold's letter is very good!
It’s not humility is it Tosh, its superiority masquerading as humility.
Have you any idea what humility is?
I wasn't talking about true humility; I thought that was obvious!
And yes, I unfortunately do know what true humility is like.
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Uriah heep was "Ever so Umble", i used to be a roofer and as such we didn't take any crap from customers, that is because customers perceived us as Carnivores where as WC's perceived as Herbivores or grazers if you like.
I did a roof years ago, the client then decided he didn't like the colour of the tiles and tried to negociate a substantial discount of the agreed price, i told him that as he had not payed for any of the materials supplied they were still my property and if he didn't like them i could take them off a lot quicker than they went on including the underlay and battens, he then said he would pay when he received my invoice, so i went to my van and wrote it out for him, he then said he didn't have his cheque book, i said thats ok i will accept cash, at this point he started mutter incoherently so i told my mate burt to get onto the scaffold and start removing our tiles, the client then mumbled something about not having the cash on him as obviously a large amount of money was involved, i suggested he get in the van and i would take him to the bank which he did reluctantly.
The point is if you let some clients take control of the situation they will mess you about, from the outset you have to be in control, if you suspect that clients are trying to take the P or disrespecting you don't waste your time with waffley letters, go to their doorstep and get it sorted face to face.
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humility is the best form of superiority!
Umm, it is? ??? ???
Sounds like a contradiction in terms.
You can be humble in such a manner that it's a form of superiority. I can act more humble than you, and in my head, I could think I am better person than you, because I am more humble.
I can be more spiritual than you, and also think I am a better person, because of my level of spirituality.
I can also believe I'm more intelligent than you, because I understand stuff you don't! ;D
The ego is a funny thing.
Tosh, stop trying to be clever, you've obviously a long way to go.
Go back to your taxiing ;D