[Spotfree]

What boilers are you using?

I am talking to a local caravan boiler specialist, I'm enquiring about having 2 boilers professionally fitted.

I would like to know something about it all before I go.

[dazmond]

What boilers are you using?

I am talking to a local caravan boiler specialist, I'm enquiring about having 2 boilers professionally fitted.

I would like to know something about it all before I go.

dont be silly....its not worth it mate...

1.YOU WONT BE INSURED....
2.THEY CAN LEAK AND CAUSE EXPLOSIONS AND ARE A FIRE RISK....

seriously NO insurer will insure you working away from the van USING A GAS HEATER with a flame and a source of ignition nearby(battery terminals)

[Dave Willis]

But if you do a search on here there’s a guy with the same name as Dazmond who posted how to fit one and how brilliant they are. He even had two. 😀
He must have had insurance I’d imagine.
After that there was another Dazmond who said hot water was a waste of money.
So many Dazmonds to choose from.

[Spotfree]

No, these people fit these boilers in caravans and motor homes for a living.

He can provide me with a certificate to say its all done to regulations. He just needs to add a flue to the van and all the correct pipework and regulators.

It'll be much more expensive than a DIY jobbie, but much cheaper all round than a diesel.

[dazmond]

But if you do a search on here there’s a guy with the same name as Dazmond who posted how to fit one and how brilliant they are. He even had two. 😀
He must have had insurance I’d imagine.
After that there was another Dazmond who said hot water was a waste of money.
So many Dazmonds to choose from.

thats before i had an gas explosion in my brand new van....i know other window cleaners who have had the same issue.....

[dazmond]

No, these people fit these boilers in caravans and motor homes for a living.

He can provide me with a certificate to say its all done to regulations. He just needs to add a flue to the van and all the correct pipework and regulators.

It'll be much more expensive than a DIY jobbie, but much cheaper all round than a diesel.

ok good luck with it......i still dont think your insurance will cover you though......

[dazmond]

But if you do a search on here there’s a guy with the same name as Dazmond who posted how to fit one and how brilliant they are. He even had two. 😀
He must have had insurance I’d imagine.
After that there was another Dazmond who said hot water was a waste of money.
So many Dazmonds to choose from.

none of us learn anything without making a few mistakes/misjudgements......

[Spotfree]

No, these people fit these boilers in caravans and motor homes for a living.

He can provide me with a certificate to say its all done to regulations. He just needs to add a flue to the van and all the correct pipework and regulators.

It'll be much more expensive than a DIY jobbie, but much cheaper all round than a diesel.

ok good luck with it......i still dont think your insurance will cover you though......

Cheers, If they don't then its a no go!

But you do have plumbers and motorhomes not much bigger than a tranny with these thing in so it must be nothing new to my insurer?

[PHILIP HARDY]

Just save yourself the money and use cold, hot is not nessasary,(without opening up the hot V cold debate), even the most dedicated users of hot only claim a 3 or 4 % improvement in time spent on the glass and many hundreds on here operate succesfully with cold pure, 24/7/365 days a year, so basically why bother !!! Tiny savings v High danger risk v bad cost efectiveness.
I always thught businessmen had to maxmise profitability not expenditure.

[dazmond]

No, these people fit these boilers in caravans and motor homes for a living.

He can provide me with a certificate to say its all done to regulations. He just needs to add a flue to the van and all the correct pipework and regulators.

It'll be much more expensive than a DIY jobbie, but much cheaper all round than a diesel.

ok good luck with it......i still dont think your insurance will cover you though......

Cheers, If they don't then its a no go!

But you do have plumbers and motorhomes not much bigger than a tranny with these thing in so it must be nothing new to my insurer?

that place in ireland(sureclean i think) used to fit gas heaters but i dont think they do now....im sure pure O2 also fit gas heaters but i think their on par with the price of a diesel heater(and you have to use 8mm minibore which would put me off)

[dazmond]

Just save yourself the money and use cold, hot is not nessasary,(without opening up the hot V cold debate), even the most dedicated users of hot only claim a 3 or 4 % improvement in time spent on the glass and many hundreds on here operate succesfully with cold pure, 24/7/365 days a year, so basically why bother !!! Tiny savings v High danger risk v bad cost efectiveness.
I always thught businessmen had to maxmise profitability not expenditure.

maybe for you but if your cleaning for a living day in/day out it stands to reason using hot water makes the job easier/more comfortable(esp during the winter months)......

it is a luxury but i like a bit of luxury when working.......also paul works on the coast so the windows he ll be cleaning will be minging!so hot water will be well worth it for him......just make sure you charge a bit more than the cold water cleaners in your area to cover the extra cost.....

[Jonny 87]

Insurance is the main one.

Phone up your insurance and explain to them what will be happening. Operating the heater while away from the vehicle etc.

I couldn’t get an answer that I was covered from multiple insurers.

Then I also had a gas leak and the flame on the ignition caught the end of the gas hose. 

If I was you I’d go down the immersion route. It will give you warm water and will be fine.

Hot is a luxury. I wouldn’t go back to cold, but I would only do it if i had 4K sitting around in savings that I didn’t particularly need.

[Spotfree]

Ive had a 3kw element on for 12 hours last night, warm water is all I'm cleaning with today.

It does seem to help on them snail trails though, and Daz is right about being on the coast, some months are a nightmare.

I get pain in most of my joints and if hot can make things a little easier without paying too much then it could be for me.

[nathankaye]

Do you fill straight into the van from tap etc or do you fill an ibc and then transfer?
If ibc, consider insulation perhaps so your starting with a steady temp to begin with.
Have you insulated the van tank as well?
Also do you use all the water you take out each day?  For instance I dont and so my starting temp before i turn on the immersion can be higher than the ibc water.

[KS Cleaning]

Ive had a 3kw element on for 12 hours last night, warm water is all I'm cleaning with today.

It does seem to help on them snail trails though, and Daz is right about being on the coast, some months are a nightmare.

I get pain in most of my joints and if hot can make things a little easier without paying too much then it could be for me.

Have you upgraded your electrics to support a 3KW immersion?  How much water were you heating? If you only got lukewarm water after 12 hours it either isn’t a 3KW element or the thermostat is set at minimum.

[Smudger]

good points

ambient temp alone would result in a tepid starting temp - 12 hours in this should be right up there temp wise
Darran

[Dry Clean]

Just save yourself the money and use cold, hot is not nessasary,(without opening up the hot V cold debate), even the most dedicated users of hot only claim a 3 or 4 % improvement in time spent on the glass and many hundreds on here operate succesfully with cold pure, 24/7/365 days a year, so basically why bother !!! Tiny savings v High danger risk v bad cost efectiveness.
I always thught businessmen had to maxmise profitability not expenditure.

Philip how would you even measure 3 or 4% ? this is nothing more than wanting the latest mobile phone and making up excuses to buy one, that said if fitted and used right a good quality LPG heater is safe enough,

[Dave Willis]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

[dazmond]

Ive had a 3kw element on for 12 hours last night, warm water is all I'm cleaning with today.

It does seem to help on them snail trails though, and Daz is right about being on the coast, some months are a nightmare.

I get pain in most of my joints and if hot can make things a little easier without paying too much then it could be for me.

id still go for a 9kw 2 man twin pump diesel heater mate......maybe you could get one second hand if you dont fancy shelling out for a brand new one?

[Status Check]

What boilers are you using?

I am talking to a local caravan boiler specialist, I'm enquiring about having 2 boilers professionally fitted.

I would like to know something about it all before I go.

If you are going to put the gas bottle in a sealed cabinet with a  gas ventilation grill in the cabinet floorI would suggest this one.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LPG-Propane-Gas-2-1GPM-Instant-Tankless-8L-min-FASTAR-Hot-Water-Heater-Boiler/123855696582?hash=item1cd65ff2c6:g:aHoAAOSwTQxdP7Vz

[Spotfree]

Do you fill straight into the van from tap etc or do you fill an ibc and then transfer?
If ibc, consider insulation perhaps so your starting with a steady temp to begin with.
Have you insulated the van tank as well?
Also do you use all the water you take out each day?  For instance I dont and so my starting temp before i turn on the immersion can be higher than the ibc water.

I transfer from an IBC.

I didnt insulate as wanted the van stay max warmth for winter. The immersion was never intended for "hot" water.

I rarely have water left out of my 650ltr (600 when alls said and done)

[Spotfree]

Ive had a 3kw element on for 12 hours last night, warm water is all I'm cleaning with today.

It does seem to help on them snail trails though, and Daz is right about being on the coast, some months are a nightmare.

I get pain in most of my joints and if hot can make things a little easier without paying too much then it could be for me.

Have you upgraded your electrics to support a 3KW immersion?  How much water were you heating? If you only got lukewarm water after 12 hours it either isn’t a 3KW element or the thermostat is set at minimum.

I was an electrical engineer before cleaning windows, the 3kw is wired from its own breaker in the consumer unit through a full 16 amp installation.

I say "lukewarm" I don't know what the temp is really, I just know its not hot.

[Spotfree]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

I'm talking about having a professionally fitted system by people who know how to make safe and provide all the correct equipment and a flue.

I could go and knock one myself in no time, but if I did then it might not be safe.

There are countless motor homes around the country with simple installation in, to fit these kinds of things there is a specific qualification.

[Dry Clean]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

[Dry Clean]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

I'm talking about having a professionally fitted system by people who know how to make safe and provide all the correct equipment and a flue.

I could go and knock one myself in no time, but if I did then it might not be safe.

There are countless motor homes around the country with simple installation in, to fit these kinds of things there is a specific qualification.

A professional gas system wont be much cheaper than a diesel system as Dazmond mentioned Sureclean in N Ireland used to sell them but at around £3k they just didn't get the custom.

[dazmond]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

is that what you ve done with your gas heater set up sean?

can we all see some pics of your set up please?

[Dry Clean]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

is that what you ve done with your gas heater set up sean?

can we all see some pics of your set up please?

No I only used mine for a few weeks to try it out, put the flue out though the side door, didn't want to cut holes in the van unless I was sure I was going to keep it.

[Stoots]

Having a gas boiler in a van is just nuts.

If you want cheap get an immersion

[dazmond]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

is that what you ve done with your gas heater set up sean?

can we all see some pics of your set up please?

No I only used mine for a few weeks to try it out, put the flue out though the side door, didn't want to cut holes in the van unless I was sure I was going to keep it.

i didnt think so........

you never help anyone out do you sean?

[Dry Clean]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

is that what you ve done with your gas heater set up sean?

can we all see some pics of your set up please?

No I only used mine for a few weeks to try it out, put the flue out though the side door, didn't want to cut holes in the van unless I was sure I was going to keep it.

i didnt think so........

you never help anyone out do you sean?

I tried to help you out but you still wasted your money, its not hard, buy a decent heater, put a flue on it and put the bottle in a gas bottle container, you can even buy a gas detector to check that the fittings aren't leaking.

[dazmond]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

is that what you ve done with your gas heater set up sean?

can we all see some pics of your set up please?

No I only used mine for a few weeks to try it out, put the flue out though the side door, didn't want to cut holes in the van unless I was sure I was going to keep it.

i didnt think so........

you never help anyone out do you sean?

I tried to help you out but you still wasted your money, its not hard, buy a decent heater, put a flue on it and put the bottle in a gas bottle container, you can even buy a gas detector to check that the fittings aren't leaking.

the problems with gas heaters are

1.the flame goes out on a windy day,very frustrating....
2.changing gas bottles!i used to always run out when i needed it most(half way through a first clean or add on job usually)
3.pressure dead end settings...i had endless problems getting the CAL setting right which resulted in connectors blowing off and wrecking hoses.....
4.drain screw........i forgot one night in the middle of winter and it froze inside and broke it.....
5.potential of a gas leak......from the heater or the regulator......
6.potential of carbon monoxide build up in the van.....
7.grey area regarding insurance.....

also i didnt "waste" my money on a diesel heater.....it doesnt have ANY of the above problems.......i would of just blown the 4.5k on a few holidays abroad with my missus anyway....

[P @ F]

  go Daz

[CleanClear]

Hot water cleans better than cold water in the same way that pure water leeches all the impurities from what it touches, and ordinary water don't.

[Jonny 87]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

How would any of the above helped me in my scenario and dazmonds I believe?

I hand a gas leak from the inlet of the boiler. No safety measure could help that. It’s either gas tight, or it leaks. Who’s to say when that point happens and it starts leaking.

The difference is that to all other uses of these heaters ( dog groomers, chippy vans, motor homes) they are right next to the heater while it’s operating. Any problems and your right there to sort it. Not 100 metres away round the corner working away blissfully unaware as your van burns down.

Mark my words it’s just a matter of time before there’s a major accident with a window cleaner using one of these. There’s been Atleast 3 close calls on this forum, Mayb more.

[P @ F]

I never had a close call like you guys in the 7 or 8 years l had my L5 in the van , I changed because gas prices went up , I also saw that Transit that had a bottle leak and changed shape a bit !
Plus the fact I had built my diesel heater , during the testing stages I pulled the L5 apart to maybe use the heat exchanger in a different way.
What I found scared the poop out of me , the gas regulator body had a hairline fracture in it , could have explained why I was using so much gas , maybe I had been a lucky boy for some time, we will never know !
I did love the L5 though , but I would never go back to gas now , I would rather go immersions or stay cold .

[Dry Clean]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

How would any of the above helped me in my scenario and dazmonds I believe?

I hand a gas leak from the inlet of the boiler. No safety measure could help that. It’s either gas tight, or it leaks. Who’s to say when that point happens and it starts leaking.

The difference is that to all other uses of these heaters ( dog groomers, chippy vans, motor homes) they are right next to the heater while it’s operating. Any problems and your right there to sort it. Not 100 metres away round the corner working away blissfully unaware as your van burns down.

Mark my words it’s just a matter of time before there’s a major accident with a window cleaner using one of these. There’s been Atleast 3 close calls on this forum, Mayb more.

Caravan and motorhome users will run gas heaters and so on when not in them but if a gas appliance is going to blow up why would it be an advantage to be next to it ? fact is there are millions of regulators used throughout the country and the only people who ever have problems with them are shiners looking for an excuse to buy the latest gadget.
I cant say that some idiot wont blow himself up but I do know if I ever needed to use a hot water placebo I would be more than confident that my DIY gas hot system would be safe to use,

[Dry Clean]

Dazmonds heater did what most gas heaters will do if they fail to ignite on time, the build up of gas exploded, in caravans and motorhomes the flame would have went up the flue causing no damage or harm.

[Status Check]

Dazmond sang the virtues of a LPG heater to everyone before he had his little mishap.

Why did he have this "mishap" ?

Because he installed it incorrectly in his new leased van.

[Jonny 87]

I disagree, the heater could be safe but any gas leak from the bottle, regulator or pipework is a bomb in the making. My regulator leaked, I was lucky and got away with it. Had the gas ignited I dread to think what could have happened.
Think about it, any gas leak is going to fill the back of the van, all that gas around your battery terminals, controller, pump, boiler and connections ........ madness.

The bottle needs to be in a container that's vented from the bottom, you can buy them on Ebay for around £100, from mobile dog grooming vans , chippy vans, motorhomes, caravans and so on there are thousands of vehicles driving around the UK with gas appliances that don't have any problems, lets get real here when it comes to Dazmond the further away he gets from a self installed LPG system the better but for somebody with a bit of DIY knowledge and some common sense then a safe LPG set up is very achievable, just don't cut corners, box the bottle and flue the heater.

How would any of the above helped me in my scenario and dazmonds I believe?

I hand a gas leak from the inlet of the boiler. No safety measure could help that. It’s either gas tight, or it leaks. Who’s to say when that point happens and it starts leaking.

The difference is that to all other uses of these heaters ( dog groomers, chippy vans, motor homes) they are right next to the heater while it’s operating. Any problems and your right there to sort it. Not 100 metres away round the corner working away blissfully unaware as your van burns down.

Mark my words it’s just a matter of time before there’s a major accident with a window cleaner using one of these. There’s been Atleast 3 close calls on this forum, Mayb more.

Caravan and motorhome users will run gas heaters and so on when not in them but if a gas appliance is going to blow up why would it be an advantage to be next to it ? fact is there are millions of regulators used throughout the country and the only people who ever have problems with them are shiners looking for an excuse to buy the latest gadget.
I cant say that some idiot wont blow himself up but I do know if I ever needed to use a hot water placebo I would be more than confident that my DIY gas hot system would be safe to use,

Erm........... because you smell almost instantly that there is a gas leak. Funny story,  they actually add the smell into gas so it acts like a warning. Who’d of thunk it. You have to have your nose in the same vehicle though of course.

[Spotfree]

I went in today and had a chat, big garage full of motorhomes.

He tells I need a sealed unit with the gas bottle inside, that has a flue. I also need a flue in the van.I need a stopcock to switch the supply off when the van is in motion.

For £400 he can install me a tank that I fill from a port in the van like the fuel tank.

So all in if I supply the boilers he'll install everything to regulation and provide a certificate for £8-900 sounds ok to me.

I mentioned that some people were skeptical about it being safe, he just grinned and said he's been doing this for a living for years.

[Spruce]

I went in today and had a chat, big garage full of motorhomes.

He tells I need a sealed unit with the gas bottle inside, that has a flue. I also need a flue in the van.I need a stopcock to switch the supply off when the van is in motion.

For £400 he can install me a tank that I fill from a port in the van like the fuel tank.

So all in if I supply the boilers he'll install everything to regulation and provide a certificate for £8-900 sounds ok to me.

I mentioned that some people were skeptical about it being safe, he just grinned and said he's been doing this for a living for years.

Is there a garage nearby that supplies gas?

Our nearest is 6 miles away. The one 'around the corner' stopped selling gas a while back "as there was no call for it." I asked at this garage 6 miles away what the demand for LPG was a while back. The fuel attendant said "not much." If that goes then the nearest supplier is 10 miles away.

With fewer and fewer old V8 petrol  4 x 4's around converted to gas I can understand the reduced demand for LPG gas tbh.
Also remember your refillable gas bottle has an expiry date of 10 years.

If you do find an insurance company to insure the van with gas then they will probably want to see an inspection certificate issued every year.

[Spotfree]

I live in Caravan city, the North Wales coast has one of the most densely populated areas for caravans. The local Morrison's do it he told me.

I was thinking it would be best to have some kind of yearly inspection/service, so a cert for that would be no bother.

Spruce, what boiler would be best, please? I want something reliable and safe, I don't mind too much about the price I just dont want anything unreliable or dangerous.

[dazmond]

Dazmond sang the virtues of a LPG heater to everyone before he had his little mishap.

Why did he have this "mishap" ?

Because he installed it incorrectly in his new leased van.

im so glad ive got a diesel heater now though rather than gas....its far more reliable and safer.....a lot less hassle too..........

[dd]

Can your guy not supply or recommend a good boiler?

[dazmond]

I went in today and had a chat, big garage full of motorhomes.

He tells I need a sealed unit with the gas bottle inside, that has a flue. I also need a flue in the van.I need a stopcock to switch the supply off when the van is in motion.

For £400 he can install me a tank that I fill from a port in the van like the fuel tank.

So all in if I supply the boilers he'll install everything to regulation and provide a certificate for £8-900 sounds ok to me.

I mentioned that some people were skeptical about it being safe, he just grinned and said he's been doing this for a living for years.

ok....it looks like you ve made up your mind paul...good luck with it......

id still recommend going for a webasto 9kw diesel heater though with 2 pumps for your 650L tank over a cheaper gas heater any day of the week.........

[Jonny 87]

I went in today and had a chat, big garage full of motorhomes.

He tells I need a sealed unit with the gas bottle inside, that has a flue. I also need a flue in the van.I need a stopcock to switch the supply off when the van is in motion.

For £400 he can install me a tank that I fill from a port in the van like the fuel tank.

So all in if I supply the boilers he'll install everything to regulation and provide a certificate for £8-900 sounds ok to me.

I mentioned that some people were skeptical about it being safe, he just grinned and said he's been doing this for a living for years.

Are you not missing a vital piece to this puzzle, the same piece that also put me off........ van insurance.

Get it in writing from your van insurance that you are covered for this and I’ll give you the £1000 myself.   

[Smudger]

Now thats tempting ! if I get it writing do I get the grand

personally I think LPG is unsuitable because of the job we do - unlike other trades mentioned we move and travel lots of times every day, the heater is shoe horned into a van with other equipment - frequently hung on a door where they are subject to even more movement and being knocked about  - then many (if not all) used an unsecured gas bottle - little wonder they leaked  and I haven't even started on dazmonds prowese at DIY 

Darran

[P @ F]

Let’s not forget  that a gas  on demand boiler  only gives hot water after fire up , each time you finish a job the water in the hose will cool , when you start again it will take a while for the hot water to get to the brush head, and more often than not you could already be half way through before any benefit is gotten.
That for me was the falling down point with LPG , it would have to be on all day to maintain a decent temperature, that would cost way more than diesel heating

[Jonny 87]

Now thats tempting ! if I get it writing do I get the grand

personally I think LPG is unsuitable because of the job we do - unlike other trades mentioned we move and travel lots of times every day, the heater is shoe horned into a van with other equipment - frequently hung on a door where they are subject to even more movement and being knocked about  - then many (if not all) used an unsecured gas bottle - little wonder they leaked  and I haven't even started on dazmonds prowese at DIY 

Darran

Terms and conditions apply. 

[Spotfree]

I had the immersion on yesterday for 11 hours, I thought I would test the temp and surprisingly it was 44 degrees coming out of the brush.

Using the online calculator the water inside the tank would have been around 50 degrees for 11 hours, a few more hours and I could have 65 degrees in the tank and around 55-60 at the brush.

At 15 pence per kilowatt, that's only 45 pence per hour or £5.40 for the night.

I suppose if I got some insulation for the tank it may get even hotter.

It all depends on how hot I actually need the water to be? I have left some particularly dirty dishes wrapped in tin foil on the side, I'm going to wash them with my pots brush and different temperature water today to see firstly how much difference hot makes and what temps are most effective.

[Spruce]

Now thats tempting ! if I get it writing do I get the grand

personally I think LPG is unsuitable because of the job we do - unlike other trades mentioned we move and travel lots of times every day, the heater is shoe horned into a van with other equipment - frequently hung on a door where they are subject to even more movement and being knocked about  - then many (if not all) used an unsecured gas bottle - little wonder they leaked  and I haven't even started on dazmonds prowese at DIY 

Darran

For me I see 2 major issues for you as an employer.

1. Insurance.
2. Duty of care. Its your moral and legal responsibility to ensure the well being and safety of your employees even if they act foolishly and disregard for their own safety.

As a sole trader you are accountable for your actions. When you employ you are accountable for your employees actions as well.

We have a friend who owns a stationery business with a delivery van and 2 part time delivery drivers. In the winter he fits winter tyres to the van to ensure the driver has the best grip available in cold, wet, icy weather. That's his duty of care. If the driver has an accident he can't blame the tyres.  On all their own cars they just use standard summer tyres in the winter as well because they are the only drivers.

[Spruce]

I live in Caravan city, the North Wales coast has one of the most densely populated areas for caravans. The local Morrison's do it he told me.

I was thinking it would be best to have some kind of yearly inspection/service, so a cert for that would be no bother.

Spruce, what boiler would be best, please? I want something reliable and safe, I don't mind too much about the price I just dont want anything unreliable or dangerous.

This is a difficult question to answer.

Someone put a link to a boiler somewhere on one of the posts. Many have used that boiler sucessfully. I know of one that has been in the van for the past 6 years and still works when needed.
There have been others than haven't managed to get the same reliability out of the same model. But as someone once said. at the price buy half a dozen and replace them if one fails.

A few years ago a poster ordered another make from the States for around £160. My guess was that the components were also made in the same Chinese factory. The boilers also didn't have the CE mark which again would be an insurance issue if things went wrong.

A fellow windie fitted one of these Ebay ones and it worked fine with a vent through the roof. Unfortunately the regulator started to leak and filled the van with gas whilst he was working. Thankfully he came back to the van and turned the gas off at the bottle. He removed the whole unit that evening and has gone back to cold water.

I would certainly ask your caravan guys what boilers they recommend. They have much more practical experience than we do.

In our application we need a boiler that will light up with a flow as low as 1 to 1.5lpm. Most tankless gas boilers don't fit this criteria as they are designed to heat water to fill a kitchen sink or bath quickly using a higher flow rate.

[Spotfree]

I live in Caravan city, the North Wales coast has one of the most densely populated areas for caravans. The local Morrison's do it he told me.

I was thinking it would be best to have some kind of yearly inspection/service, so a cert for that would be no bother.

Spruce, what boiler would be best, please? I want something reliable and safe, I don't mind too much about the price I just dont want anything unreliable or dangerous.

This is a difficult question to answer.

Someone put a link to a boiler somewhere on one of the posts. Many have used that boiler sucessfully. I know of one that has been in the van for the past 6 years and still works when needed.
There have been others than haven't managed to get the same reliability out of the same model. But as someone once said. at the price buy half a dozen and replace them if one fails.

A few years ago a poster ordered another make from the States for around £160. My guess was that the components were also made in the same Chinese factory. The boilers also didn't have the CE mark which again would be an insurance issue if things went wrong.

A fellow windie fitted one of these Ebay ones and it worked fine with a vent through the roof. Unfortunately the regulator started to leak and filled the van with gas whilst he was working. Thankfully he came back to the van and turned the gas off at the bottle. He removed the whole unit that evening and has gone back to cold water.

I would certainly ask your caravan guys what boilers they recommend. They have much more practical experience than we do.

In our application we need a boiler that will light up with a flow as low as 1 to 1.5lpm. Most tankless gas boilers don't fit this criteria as they are designed to heat water to fill a kitchen sink or bath quickly using a higher flow rate.

Thanks.

I am going to have a go at insulating the tank and giving the immersion a chance, I can get my water to around 60-65 degrees with around 13 hours of heating.

I think I am losing around 5-10 degrees by the time the water gets to the glass, so I'll be testing for a few weeks to see if 50-55 degree water is hot enough to make a noticeable difference.

I have heard people talking about 60-70 degrees being needed, I'll find out for myself as I imagine its a personal preference kind of thing.

[Splash & dash]

I live in Caravan city, the North Wales coast has one of the most densely populated areas for caravans. The local Morrison's do it he told me.

I was thinking it would be best to have some kind of yearly inspection/service, so a cert for that would be no bother.

Spruce, what boiler would be best, please? I want something reliable and safe, I don't mind too much about the price I just dont want anything unreliable or dangerous.

This is a difficult question to answer.

Someone put a link to a boiler somewhere on one of the posts. Many have used that boiler sucessfully. I know of one that has been in the van for the past 6 years and still works when needed.
There have been others than haven't managed to get the same reliability out of the same model. But as someone once said. at the price buy half a dozen and replace them if one fails.

A few years ago a poster ordered another make from the States for around £160. My guess was that the components were also made in the same Chinese factory. The boilers also didn't have the CE mark which again would be an insurance issue if things went wrong.

A fellow windie fitted one of these Ebay ones and it worked fine with a vent through the roof. Unfortunately the regulator started to leak and filled the van with gas whilst he was working. Thankfully he came back to the van and turned the gas off at the bottle. He removed the whole unit that evening and has gone back to cold water.

I would certainly ask your caravan guys what boilers they recommend. They have much more practical experience than we do.

In our application we need a boiler that will light up with a flow as low as 1 to 1.5lpm. Most tankless gas boilers don't fit this criteria as they are designed to heat water to fill a kitchen sink or bath quickly using a higher flow rate.

Thanks.

I am going to have a go at insulating the tank and giving the immersion a chance, I can get my water to around 60-65 degrees with around 13 hours of heating.

I think I am losing around 5-10 degrees by the time the water gets to the glass, so I'll be testing for a few weeks to see if 50-55 degree water is hot enough to make a noticeable difference.

I have heard people talking about 60-70 degrees being needed, I'll find out for myself as I imagine its a personal preference kind of thing.

I think it will cost you more than £5 something per  night to heat it up for 13 hours , if you have a night Tartuffe or what ever they call it it’s only cheaper between 1 am and 7 am the other hours will be a lot more . It wouldn’t cost any more to run a two man 9kw diesel system .and that will be piping hot all day not just Luke warm after lunch

[Spotfree]

Our leccy is 15p per kilowatt.
3kw element so 3kw per hour.
45p per hour.
13 x 45 = £5.85

Night rate tariff's are no good to me, have 2 kids and use a lot of electric during the day.

I would like a proper diesel heater but not willing to part with that amount of money for it, someone will be doing it cheaper soon, always happens.

[Spruce]

Our leccy is 15p per kilowatt.
3kw element so 3kw per hour.
45p per hour.
13 x 45 = £5.85

Night rate tariff's are no good to me, have 2 kids and use a lot of electric during the day.

I would like a proper diesel heater but not willing to part with that amount of money for it, someone will be doing it cheaper soon, always happens.

We've been saying that for years and it still hasn't happened.
There were some Chinese copies of the Thermo Top C diesel heaters advertised a while back but they seem to have disappeared without a trace.

The problem with the Pound/Euro value comparision atm will only mean they will cost more, not less.

[P @ F]

Well you have these now , might be a build waiting to happen !

[dazmond]

Our leccy is 15p per kilowatt.
3kw element so 3kw per hour.
45p per hour.
13 x 45 = £5.85

Night rate tariff's are no good to me, have 2 kids and use a lot of electric during the day.

I would like a proper diesel heater but not willing to part with that amount of money for it, someone will be doing it cheaper soon, always happens.

why would any WFP company professionally fit these heaters cheaper?in fact they ve got more expensive over the years(just like our customers window cleaning bill)....its a niche market so they can charge good prices.......the likes of grippa are stacked out with fitting systems in the winter months as it was a few months wait to book me in...

if your VAT registered then you can claim £750 back out of the £4.5k ....i had to take the hit.......so that takes it down to £3,750 including fitting,you could get it down even less if you have your own leisure batteries and smart split charge relay as these were included in the price of mine as well as controller,frost stat and cabinet,etc....

unfortunately theres no cutting corners when it comes to a decent hot water system(i know as ive tried!)

[P @ F]

Better view

https://m.aliexpress.com/item/33018892208.html?trace=wwwdetail2mobilesitedetail&fbclid=IwAR0jW3KaQDGLEqyOuYIpuaBEMr0ckNDoftz01yZfiRJparqwvgYdtE_Jo3c&tt=sns_none&aff_platform=default&cpt=1566649009647&sk=baAGFs0C&aff_trace_key=f82d94f21fc14bb7bbe91b82bd7cb917-1566649009647-08184-baAGFs0C&terminal_id=d8907decbca5443d9dceacf4d791b788

[Dry Clean]

Now thats tempting ! if I get it writing do I get the grand

personally I think LPG is unsuitable because of the job we do - unlike other trades mentioned we move and travel lots of times every day, the heater is shoe horned into a van with other equipment - frequently hung on a door where they are subject to even more movement and being knocked about  - then many (if not all) used an unsecured gas bottle - little wonder they leaked  and I haven't even started on dazmonds prowese at DIY 

Darran

For me I see 2 major issues for you as an employer.

1. Insurance.
2. Duty of care. Its your moral and legal responsibility to ensure the well being and safety of your employees even if they act foolishly and disregard for their own safety.

As a sole trader you are accountable for your actions. When you employ you are accountable for your employees actions as well.

We have a friend who owns a stationery business with a delivery van and 2 part time delivery drivers. In the winter he fits winter tyres to the van to ensure the driver has the best grip available in cold, wet, icy weather. That's his duty of care. If the driver has an accident he can't blame the tyres.  On all their own cars they just use standard summer tyres in the winter as well because they are the only drivers.

Above 8 degrees winter tyres are actually more dangerous than normal tyres which is why most if not all sensible people/ employers don't bother with them, ( Royal mail being one example) some people just cant see the wood for the trees.

[Splash & dash]

Our leccy is 15p per kilowatt.
3kw element so 3kw per hour.
45p per hour.
13 x 45 = £5.85

Night rate tariff's are no good to me, have 2 kids and use a lot of electric during the day.

I would like a proper diesel heater but not willing to part with that amount of money for it, someone will be doing it cheaper soon, always happens.

I seam to remember somewhere I think you said you are doing  around 65k per year by spending a bit of that on a diesel heater it would be good for your tax bill 😂😂😂 . We work a lot on the coast and I have to say with salt ,sand, seagull poo baked on to widows , hot is so much quicker , easier and better results, I could never go back to cold , Ime sure if you got a proper hot system you would soon see the advantages ,and use it all year round ,as we do

[Spotfree]

Our leccy is 15p per kilowatt.
3kw element so 3kw per hour.
45p per hour.
13 x 45 = £5.85

Night rate tariff's are no good to me, have 2 kids and use a lot of electric during the day.

I would like a proper diesel heater but not willing to part with that amount of money for it, someone will be doing it cheaper soon, always happens.

I seam to remember somewhere I think you said you are doing  around 65k per year by spending a bit of that on a diesel heater it would be good for your tax bill 😂😂😂 . We work a lot on the coast and I have to say with salt ,sand, seagull poo baked on to widows , hot is so much quicker , easier and better results, I could never go back to cold , Ime sure if you got a proper hot system you would soon see the advantages ,and use it all year round ,as we do

I do work hard, and I would like one, but its still a lot of money to spend.

[Splash & dash]

Our leccy is 15p per kilowatt.
3kw element so 3kw per hour.
45p per hour.
13 x 45 = £5.85

Night rate tariff's are no good to me, have 2 kids and use a lot of electric during the day.

I would like a proper diesel heater but not willing to part with that amount of money for it, someone will be doing it cheaper soon, always happens.

I seam to remember somewhere I think you said you are doing  around 65k per year by spending a bit of that on a diesel heater it would be good for your tax bill 😂😂😂 . We work a lot on the coast and I have to say with salt ,sand, seagull poo baked on to widows , hot is so much quicker , easier and better results, I could never go back to cold , Ime sure if you got a proper hot system you would soon see the advantages ,and use it all year round ,as we do

I do work hard, and I would like one, but its still a lot of money to spend.

I agree with what you are saying , but as far as Ime concerned it makes my working day much easier ,faster, and more productive , it’s a no brainier , I wish now I had got one years ago but there you go  hindsight is a wonderful thing   

[Dry Clean]

Our leccy is 15p per kilowatt.
3kw element so 3kw per hour.
45p per hour.
13 x 45 = £5.85

Night rate tariff's are no good to me, have 2 kids and use a lot of electric during the day.

I would like a proper diesel heater but not willing to part with that amount of money for it, someone will be doing it cheaper soon, always happens.

I seam to remember somewhere I think you said you are doing  around 65k per year by spending a bit of that on a diesel heater it would be good for your tax bill 😂😂😂 . We work a lot on the coast and I have to say with salt ,sand, seagull poo baked on to widows , hot is so much quicker , easier and better results, I could never go back to cold , Ime sure if you got a proper hot system you would soon see the advantages ,and use it all year round ,as we do

I do work hard, and I would like one, but its still a lot of money to spend.

Its only a lot of money to spend if it doesn't pay its way, liking one is for Dazmond, Jonny 87 and all the other faffers, needing one means you have no choice but to find a way to buy one because without it you are losing money.

[Slacky]

Let’s not forget  that a gas  on demand boiler  only gives hot water after fire up , each time you finish a job the water in the hose will cool , when you start again it will take a while for the hot water to get to the brush head, and more often than not you could already be half way through before any benefit is gotten.
That for me was the falling down point with LPG , it would have to be on all day to maintain a decent temperature, that would cost way more than diesel heating

Not if you circulate it.

[Splash & dash]

Let’s not forget  that a gas  on demand boiler  only gives hot water after fire up , each time you finish a job the water in the hose will cool , when you start again it will take a while for the hot water to get to the brush head, and more often than not you could already be half way through before any benefit is gotten.
That for me was the falling down point with LPG , it would have to be on all day to maintain a decent temperature, that would cost way more than diesel heating

Not if you circulate it.

That’s true but it’s not supposed to be running  between jobs , so you cannot circulate it , if you run it continuously you will need a tanker behind you to supply enough gas 😂😂😂

[P @ F]

Above is so true , and  don’t forget the 20 minute cut out  ,  gas is a no go with re-circ  !

[Spotfree]

I've got 4 farmhouses to do this morning, all 8 weeks (10 weeks due to summer break) and they get full of the countryside on the glass and frames.

I put 400 liters in last night and put the immersion on for 12 hours, so I should have 70+ degrees this morning. I am hoping for 65 degrees on the glass.

I should know by the end of today if I do want hot or not.

[Jonny 87]

I've got 4 farmhouses to do this morning, all 8 weeks (10 weeks due to summer break) and they get full of the countryside on the glass and frames.

I put 400 liters in last night and put the immersion on for 12 hours, so I should have 70+ degrees this morning. I am hoping for 65 degrees on the glass.

I should know by the end of today if I do want hot or not.

One other downside to the immersion is that your starting temp is your starting temp. You can’t adjust it. There’s certain houses I definitely wouldn't be using 60 degree water on. Thin pains of glass can crack etc.

If they are double glazed units you should be ok though. 

[Spotfree]

I've got 4 farmhouses to do this morning, all 8 weeks (10 weeks due to summer break) and they get full of the countryside on the glass and frames.

I put 400 liters in last night and put the immersion on for 12 hours, so I should have 70+ degrees this morning. I am hoping for 65 degrees on the glass.

I should know by the end of today if I do want hot or not.

One other downside to the immersion is that your starting temp is your starting temp. You can’t adjust it. There’s certain houses I definitely wouldn't be using 60 degree water on. Thin pains of glass can crack etc.

If they are double glazed units you should be ok though.

Good point, I wouldn't of considered that.

Thanks