[woodman]

And old chestnut on here now but after this quote worth mentioning again,

I did and estimate today for a customer of mine who then produced a leaflet she had through her letter box from a local firm and a price she had been given for the following:

Lounge/diner 18' x 12
Sitting room 13 x 12
HSL slightly larger than average.
(Total area approx 70 sq mts)
Quote Price £66.00

Mine was £245.00 + VAT and this was accepted with out hesitation.

I know  this firm and I know that they do a good job and are not a 'bodge it and leg it' outfit.

So it begs the question why charge so little, under a pound a sq mt,  when you are a qualified trained up professional carpet cleaner.



He would have to do another 3 jobs that day to match my price for one.That surely can not make any sense.

Customers in mine and his areas would be wary of such a cheap price any way for obvious reasons.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

people just can't sell there service as good as others, perhaps he's had a couple of knock backs and puts it down to price so he goes lower to compensate not knowing his own reprocussions.

[Alex]

Woody are you a millionaire £245 + VAT!

I think I need to spend some time with you so I can charge that. How the hell is the other firm making any money at £66. That's less than 10p per sq ft.  

alex

[squeaky]

I do not entirely agree,In some areas the only companies that charge £200 plus for that amount of carpets are the national companies.
I suppose it does depend on what area of the country that you work.
I would have charged in the region of £90 to do this work,but I am always busy , I have excellent equipment have been well trained and above all have over 10 years experience.I earn enough money with what I charge and am happy that the customer gets extremely good value for money and a 1st class job,70% of my business is from referals and repeat business , so I cannot be doing much wrong !
Why charge so much ? How long does it take you?
It can't take you 5 hours surely and that would be £50 an hour.
Don't knock us for doing things our way , I am happy my customers are happy , if you are content to charge what you charge so be it.
Most of the new customers are phoning around for a good price and I am sure that our price would be more favourable. :

Mark

[John_Flynn]

My price for this job would be £220.50 and I would dedicate the day to dooing it.

[Derek]

Mark

Just to pick up on a point you made... you said that 'the only people to charge this sort of money are the National Companies'

If they can do it so why not the rest of us... ?

When Chem-Dry (love 'em or hate 'em) entered the market place their marketing strategy worked superbly well and they raised the earning potential almost overnight for every other cleaning company who wished to climb on the bandwagon.

For years our industry has undersold itself and even at the prices John is quoting he is undoubtedly giving value for money... otherwise he would be out of business

We all have our own ways of doing things and we all have our own ideas on the prices we should be charging and are charging.... that's as it should be.

My prices are around the same as the two Johns' and I try to give value for money and produce the best job possible without the constraints of worrying about working to a low price.

That's simply my own point of view but I respect those of you who think otherwise.. there is a market for us all.

Regards
Derek

[Alex]

Mark,

Why you so upset about the post mate, I agree with Woody on this one as I personally think £66 for this amount of work is way to low - But each to there own.

I look to earn around £30 per hour, however, this includes equipment and getting to site.

Do we now if the carpets are dry or wet when they leave?

Alex

[Ivar_Haglund]

I just love these pricing threads

Reguardless what I say I charge someone will charge more than me.

could his over head be much less than others

no truck or machine payments doing volum over one job or two a day

at the end of the day the only thing that counts is how much is left in your pocket.



IVAR

[Les]

Personally I'm glad that these National Companies charge so much...
They tend to produce Flyers which I then use to show my Customers when pricing the work. Most of them like to use local people and there's definitely NO guarantee that their work will be better than mine   In fact I have been asked to go and redo jobs already done by these people and they been .... well not good  
So thank you 'Nationals' for helping me earn more money  
Oh and I find that I can allow more time on the job than I used to and that allows for that extra nice finish...and about 3 more cups of Tea  
Les

[jmj]

I've recentlly up the pricing of my work, I've been cleaning carpets for 8 years with the wrong attitude on pricing totally.My prices were less then the first quote posted. I would tell the customers that i used the same products, the same technique's and i wouldn't let them down, as the major companies for less then half the cost.Totally under selling myself!!I've have increased my cost roughly 40% and still get the same amount of work as before.Why i didn't do this before, i don't know.I've even had old customers ring to book in and they are more then happy with the new price. At the end of the day we all want the jobs and if you can charge top dollar and get the work then good luck to you.

joe

[Ian Gourlay]

Is this £3.50 square metre price for a gold service clean.

Is Promite etc extra or included.

Is there a spot a stain guarantee, call back etc included








Ian

[Ken Wainwright]

I raise the question "What are you?" Most people would instinctively reply "A carpet cleaner"  WRONG We are all businessmen. We're in the business of cleaning carpets. At some time in our lives, we made the conscious decision to start our own business in order to provide better for ourselves and our families, and some of us have further ambitions to build a small empire. With this in mind, wouldn't it be reasonable to expect to earn more than the average industrial wage? (a little over £400pw)

As a one man band, working from home, you can't get a much smaller business than mine. No business premises, no business rates. Yet it still costs me in excess of £10k per year in overheads to run my business. This doesn't include any drawings for me or salary for my wife. It doesn't include any capital expenditure or income tax. You need to earn quite a bit with your wand before you start putting money into your own pocket.

If you charge a lower rate, but have high productivity, whilst this is admirable, believe me, you will burn yourself out. You can't physically work flat out, day after day, week after week, year after year. I've been in this industry for quite a while now. Since I turned 50 I've noticed that muscles and joints now hurt if I haven't worked for a week or so. I've just returned from almost a month's break, lost my working fitness and boy, am I suffering now. So don't expect to be able to have the same productivity in years to come. So, you will eventually need to realign your prices to earn a reasonable living.

Ask yourself this. In this ever changing, fast moving world, what would you consider to be a realsitic income for a person of your skill, dedication, commitment and entrepeneurial spirit. £20k pa? £30k? £40k......? Are you falling short and if so why? Without wishing to be rude, if your goal is to earn a shop floor salary, you're missing the point of being a businessman.

Safe and happy cleaning:)
Ken

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Well said Ken, and I hope you had a good holiday!

Remember s/e people don't get paid hols or sick pay and if you are a little quieter than normal you have to accomodate for this, apart from the 40 hours work cleaning how many hours repairing or preparing your machinery or paper work etc and all of this to find out that most self employment NI contributions will not be enough to give you a basic state pension when you hang up your pink marigolds or what ever you use, to get more then working for an employee financially costs a lot more than you think and mentally and physically can be even greater.
One of the reasons for me being s/e was for security, I could make a better living for myself by myself with nobody beating the drum of job or pay cuts or the mundane Monday morning blues but you do give up certain things to hopefully gain in the long run but looking into the future ie saving for tomorrow by making enough today is a goal we could all do with

Shaun  

[nick_brown]

We run a Chem dry franchise-yes love us or hate us ,I couldnt agree more with ken's last post ,  if I wanted a job i could go and get one ,from the sound of  it we are not a;lone in investing large amounts of money in capital equipment ,but having tried to do most of the cleaning myself in the early days  ,you can do it for a short time but  not for long ,you want to build equoty value in your business ,a free standing unit you can sellor even if you dont why do we as an industry go on being cheap, a social service we arent?Taken your van to any garage recently  £35 hou min + parts more like 40/60/hour plus parts .plus vat. I think taht many forget  that your wages  should be after depreciation and a net profit   to cover replacing the equipment we are busy depreciating otherwise you are always  in debt!
Frankly I dont know many industries that are such physical hard work, actually save people money in eplacements and are of benefit to their health- why would you want to give it away.I hear in our industry that" I can clean so much in so long or a suite  in    1 hour" etc  I hardly ever hear about profit  as ken says we are in business or   are we all private  millionaires doing this knackering skilled work for therapy???

As they say  in USA  there  is no pride in  poverty!!!!
Regards Nick Brown

[Len Gribble]

Hi Guys

What would your prices be for Rugs?
3x3 £5
6x4 £10
6X10 £25
Over 6x10 £35
Oriental same price

This came though my letterbox today not bad prices

Don’t you just love the Oriental rugs thing?

Did hear a whisper today came from a carpet whiper, Taiwan is going into carpet manufacture.

Hi Ken nice to have you back.  

Len

[Shaun_Ashmore]

I know Chemdry have to set themselves apart from other cleaners to become unique but I thought Nick Browns comments were very much on the same lines of Kens, who comes first when living life you and your family or customers and there families.

You don't have to become richer just don't become poorer for all of your hard work

Shaun

[SMP]

And don't forget that unless you have a business that you can sell - which if you under price is unlikely, you need to be putting a LOT of money way every month for a pension - unless you plan to clean till you drop!!!!!

Cheers
Steve

[Shaun_Ashmore]

The way pensions are going it'll be better to drop!

shaun

[Dynafoam]

Hi Guys

What would your prices be for Rugs?
3x3 £5
6x4 £10
6X10 £25
Over 6x10 £35
Oriental same price

Len,

I have a minimum job charge of £50, but assuming that I was on site for other work, the price would vary dependant on the type of rug, soiling type and level, and especially, if fringed, the level of cleaning required to achieve customer satisfaction.

I might sometimes be about 250%-300% of these prices, sometimes higher than that.

John.

[Derek]

Hi Guys

I refer to my previous post when I replied in the first section to Mark

The thread has developed and I may have been writing at cross purposes. I assumed when Mark mentioned the 'National Companies' that he meant the major franchises.

I had forgotten that there are 'other' National organisations including those who rely on the half price offer leaflets... apologies

My final comments following some excellent posts on the subject.

This is a business that relies on hard work but you also have to work 'smart' too

Cheers
Derek

[squeaky]

alex,
what makes you think I am upset ?Far from it I think that
it is good to have a wide range on pricing.
However I do think that CCs do have the attitude that if another CC does a job cheaper that it is assumed that the standard is not there , also as stated before it does depend on what area you work as to what you can charge.
I have never had a complaint about my work , I pride myself on giving a 1st class service and value for money.
What is wrong in that ?
Alot of CCs have stated on this forum what they charge
I know from speaking to other CCs in my area that no-one charges anywhere near these prices (in this area) because people will not pay it.
I earn an excellent living , I do not consider that I am 'burning myself out' anyway 'NUF SAID'

mark.

[woodman]

Hi Mark

Read my original post again you will see that I said that this guy is a professional cleaner who I know does a good job.Thats why I was asking the question as to why he's prices are so low in such an affluent area.

He will struggle to survive I have no doubt of that on these prices and there is no need.

A lot of the low priced cleaners standard of work that I have come across is of poor quality and I like you I have had to follow on to countless jobs carried out by them costing the customer more in the long run.

I have no doubt that you are a superb CC but with all due respect In my opinion I believe your prices are also to low regardless of how busy you are.

You ask why charge so much?

Because I have invested a considerable amount of time in my training and equipment over the years and carry out a 'service' to the customer of the highest quality possible to me, I am highly insured to protect the customer and myself and run a business to make a profit not to survive.
My Prices reflect my driving time,setting up time,materials and my professional ability to carry out the work safely to high standard.

I know I will not convince you but it is beneficial to ALL carpet cleaners if prices are raised to a more realistic level.

[Ian Gourlay]

Hi, Woodman

Would just like to report that over the past 18months people like John Flynn and Ken have convinced me of the wisdom of raising prices.

Although I am not at their level yet my prices are considerably more than they were 18months ago.

If we want a surplus to invest in pennsions or property shares or property we do need to charhe more.

PS  I did not realise Chem Dry charged £3.50 a metre.

or have I misunderstood.

If so I can raise yet again

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Chemdry charge different prices based on their silver gold and platinum packages.

Shaun

[woodman]

Have to say Ian I havn't got a clue what Chem-Dry charge but I am glad to hear your price increases are working.

I love this quote by Michelangelo which sums it all up for me:


" The greatest danger for most of us, is not that our aim is too high and we miss it,
but that it is too low and we reach it"[/i]


Alex: No millionaires here, just ask my bank manager.
I never realised they would actualy want any money  back

[Dave_Lee]

Did a quote today, 3 Piece Suite, Lounge/Diner Hall, $ beds (Part only) Total Area 75 sq yds. My quote: Siute £110, Carpets £225 (£3 per sq yd) Total £335.
She said the guy who usually does it only charged £80.
When I asked why she hadnt called him, her reply was  - he had stopped doing it because it was too hard work. I suggest the real reason was that he wasnt making any money, while slogging his guts out. All I can say is "Been there done that" nearly went broke, and I aint going there again.
Dave.

[Len Gribble]

Dave did you get the job?

Len

[Dave_Lee]

Len,
No, not yet anyway. Im having a knee op next week, so out of action for a few weeks. She asked me to give her a phone call when Im back working.
Dave.

[Bryan H]

Is it a cartlidge Dave ?

I had op exactly 12 months ago  -  off for two weeks

Bryan

[CATMAN]

I carn'tunderstand these people who are nothing but busy fools. A guy who is local to me cleans a house 3 beds for £75 and a three piece suite for £29. For me to clean a suite properly takes four hours, at that rate he would be better packing ready meals.

These people make this industry an undervalued service, but then if they are claiming social, work with old gear out the back of an old ford escort what can they expect.

I always have people trying to knock down my prices or do the job for cash. I won't shift on either. I tell them you want a professional service, you must expect to pay for it. If you want cheap try someone else.  The are sometimes needed to be reminded that a carpet is only a thing that needs a cheap clean until it requires replacement, then its the most expensive piece of furniture in the house.  Some people don't like this, but the one's who except this are always over the moon.

Just today we cleaned a set of stairs at some offices, which had oil on. A total of 15 steps. We said £90+VAT. They wanted to pay £60inc VAT. We told them to think about and give us a call. The did accept the price and were absoulty delighted with the results.

Those guys in my area, who are operating, without; insurance, a licence to dispose of dirty water from  a truckmont, doing the double , without proper training, using elecrical equipment not PAT tested will soon realise that they carn't work for nothing
& operate with all the above requirements.

[Len Gribble]

Hi Dave

Sorry to hear about you knee, glad to hear she want you to do the cleaning, make sure your knee is full fit to do the 3 Piece Suite.

Len

[Dave_Lee]

Thanks Len, and Bryan - only two weeks - thats not so bad, I think Ill lay off the carpet fitting a while longer though - or might even stop doing it altogether especially as thats what caused the problem in the first place. Cheers.
Dave.

[MICHAEL_GAYTON]

also the other side of the coin ,is you need to charge top prices, because the machines we use cost alot to buy and keep in good nip.I spent close on 18 k replacing
12 year old TM hand tools/ van etc .I use the best and charge for it. amen
mick
ps i spent 4 hours on cream suite fri price £235-00
hard work!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :-/

[SMP]

I was re reading the post from mark (squeaky) when the comment "people round here won't pay that" caught my attention.

If everybody put their prices up people would have to pay!  The only reason people won't pay is that they know they will find somebody willing to  work for next to nothing!  Theses are usually the cleaners that go bust, or as I have seen in my area the trading name gets past on to a new owner as each finds that that it is too much like hard work at  such low prices.  There will be a minority of customers who will think that is too much and go and do it themselves - but the number of people I've come across who've said "we used to have a vax but it was hard work, took all day and the carpets squelched " I've lost track of.

Just some musings.  Cheers

[Ken Wainwright]

Steve

Your observation of "people 'round here wont pay that" is only partly true. But an observation I have also noticed about tradesmen working for lower fees is that they've never actually tried to ask for a fair price for their work. The price resistance is often coming from within themselves, not the prospects/clients/customers. You will usually find that there is someone in the area, franchise or not, able to trade with realistic remuneration.

Safe and happy cleaning:)
Ken

[dave]

I saw an advert in a local freebie paper this week. I could'nt believe the price so I even took looked at their web page and printed it off there

1 bed prop       £45.00
2 bed prop         55.00
3 bed prop         65.00
4 bed prop         75.00
5 bed prop         95.00

Surely these prices can't be for real, or are there add-ons that they would charge for that I am not aware, or is it a way of getting the phone to ring so they can fill up the quiet spots.

Regards Dave

[squeaky]

SMP

Charging reasonable prices and still a carpet cleaner after over 10 years,my truckmount is paid for as are my vehicles'Going bust ? Don't think so.

Ken

Tried charging more when 1st started but the people that phone around for prices never called back , so we got sensible with our prices and have not looked back.

The idea that if we all charged high prices it would be better for everyone is total and utter rubbish ( in my opinion) it would be better for the CCs that charge high prices now and thats all.

Let us not forget that the magority of companies that clean carpets in my area charge the same as me.

Mark

[Len Gribble]

Dave

I think you will find there prices are real and they offer Visa, MasterCard etc that cost them also, and in the majority of cases these ½ price companies don’t use trained staff, I have also come across a few (I want to pc here) that have difficulty communicating with the customers.

Any chance you could pm there web site I like a good laugh.

Len

[woodman]

Like I said Mark

I knew I wouldn't convince you that if all CC raise prices it benefits all, but it does.

Every one in your area charges the same great then raise your prices and be different.After 10 years you must have a customer base,most will remain your customers the others you can do with out  you'll also lose the price shoppers, be bold and do it.

You tried when you first started out and was frightened off like a lot of us you feared customers wouldn't pay what your worth and followed the competition. That was a long time ago,your vehicles and equipment are paid for, your in a great position ,better than most to push on and rise above the competition now.

[squeaky]

Hi Woodman,
Yes you are right you will not convince me , and I am sorry that what works for you does not work for everyone , but that is life  , I will not change a winning formula when it has given me such an excellent living for so long.
I hope that I have not offended anyone with my views.

Happy days

mark.

[Mark Betts]

Basicaslly at the end of the day, as long as you are happy with the living you are creating, what the heck doea it matter what others are charging or the profit they are making.

The pricing debate will go on forever and ever and to be honest gets a bit boring at times.

A cleaner local to me was quite pally with me at one time, even offering to help each other out etc etc until!!!!!

one day he found out that I just happened to charge a little LESS than him for cleaning certain items. Well i didnt hear the last of it and i havent heard of him since so basically he got the hump that i was cheaper.

I didnt go out to underprice him at all I just set my prices so i made a reasonable profit for MYSELF.

So at the end of the day charge what you are happy with yourselves. Dont worry about what anyone else is charging because to be honest most of em are lying anyway  

Mark

[squeaky]

Thanks for that Mark,I wish that I could have put it like that.

Mark

[Mike Halliday]

I've seen lots of formulas for working out how much a company should charge  but in the end the only true way to work out how much to charge a customer is to ask the maximum price you believe you can get away with.  

If you base your prices on the hourly rate you want to earn then what happens when you become more efficient & work quicker, you earn less money.

or if you base your prices on a calculation of bussiness & home expences, what happens when your morgage goes down or you finish a loan on that big flash truckmount, do you put your prices down?

this is why I think it is important to allow your self to be influenced by how much other companies charge because if they can get  a higher price for their cleaning then so can you!


Mike

[Dynafoam]

Mike,

That makes total sense !

Not the way I fix my prices but there are reasons for that.

If you dissagree with Mike on this one, switch on brain and re-read.

John.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

The price you sell your cleaning services at is directly proportional to what YOU can sell them at, meaning if you are not a selling person and you may do a fantastic job but do not like selling your price will be lower as you don't like the confrontation of clients saying no to you, yes you have to pay the bills but which ever equassion you work on high price or low price it's down to the selling skills of the individual.

Shaun

[Len Gribble]

Come on guys wake up and smell the coffee!

At the end of the day we all need to put bread on the table, your price is your price, if a potential NEW customer questions your price that’s when (hopefully) your selling skills come in to place, repeat business is another thing customers know things go up!

Len

[Scots_cleaner]

Selling Skills whats that .
As long as you look the part (and i look good i must say)
presentation both physically and verbally is a must.

And as long as you know you industry you should not have any probs..
Chers

Barry

[squeaky]

Scots Cleaner ,

I agree as long as you have a proffessional appearance
and know what you are doing/talking about it goes a long way , I charge the prices I charge because I am happy to.

mark

[Scots_cleaner]

Just thought i post this as im a done in with this guy.

Suite & carpet      £40.00
Suite & 2 carpets  £50.00
FABRIC SUITE        £28
1 CARPET              £18.00
2  carpets             £30
H,S,L                     £20
leather suite         £45.00 Using chemspec leather cleaner

This guy is not new hes been on the go for about 5-6 years this is his prices just went up this year

WHY WHY WHY

do these people kill it for the rest of us.....

These price have just been taken fron the local free paper he also advertises in another 2 papers

Upset..

Barry        

[John_Flynn]

Barry

Do NOT let this guy get at you, I have a Splash and Dash guy advertiseing the same prices in my local papers, the type of customers that I get laugh at his prices and remark to me 'What on earth do they do for that price'.

[SMP]

In fact Barry , he's doing you a favour!!  All those punters that want something for nothing are taking up his time, leaving you free to deal with clients that value your service.

Cheers

[MICHAEL_GAYTON]

its like cars some buy fiats others buy jags
mick

[Scots_cleaner]

I would not mind so mutch but the carpet side is quite just now....

Barry

[eclipse]

get this local company to me charges £1 per m2
and he runs a website at these prices does he get time to do the splash and dash

[Cloverleaf]

Lee,

You book the jobs and send him out at £2.50 a meter.

He works his but off while you get rich at home!

John Milnes

[eclipse]

good idea but it is my firm belieif that his standards are not as high as mine i work hard to get my customers and i want to keep them i will just wait for the phone to ring when he has screwed a job up and the customer wants the job putting right and proper

[Cloverleaf]

I agree Lea, I visit many customers who have had cleaning done before with very poor results, and dissapointed customers, in and out in one hour, and even costing more with truckmounts.

When I'v finished they are pleased if not amazed at the results. Its never been like that before etc, etc, they say.

For us lads who spend more time on getting the job right we
will not look back.

As far as prices go, I'v just increased reluctantly by 25%
to give it a try and see what the response was as I have been far underpricing.

The result! Three jobs quoted, everyone got

John Milnes

[woodman]

Thats great news John,

Keep it up (and your prices ) I bet your wondering why you didn't do it sooner.

The message is getting across, customers will become accustomed to paying the correct price for the job.

[MICHAEL_GAYTON]

woodman on the nail
AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[woodman]

Hi Guys a little follow on from the above thread which might be of interest.

went out on Friday with a new carpet cleaner who asked if I could assist him with the thorny issue of pricing in the home.

3 piece suite and lounge carpet, his price at the moment
£95.00 for both a price he had arrived at after weighing up the opposition prices in the same area and wrongly thought he had better to tow the line and compete with them at the same level.

We carried out appraisal of work to be done went through the procedure with customer explaining the benefits of LM neutral cleaning to her suite and presented her with the 'Quote' , £230.00 which was accepted with no resistance.

He then did the next quote, through lounge £80.00 ,which he also got the nod for. £310.00 two jobs confirmed that he would have charged at £120.00

Of course you won't get them all but isn't it a nice feeling carrying out the job knowing that you can take your time and your time has been priced correctly.

After this little exercise I know which pricing structure this guy will operate from now on as feels more confident with his pricing.

[CATMAN]

You fellas who say you present a professional image are right in your approach, but some people you just carn't please.

Went to do a carpet clean on Friday, for an insurance company. Lady wants new carpet. We told here we've been instructed to clean it. She moans it will take THREE days to dry. Sorry missus the carpet is almost dry before we leave. Set up our machine, hoses, etc. Lady says your not cleaning my carpet with that machine, it's been cleaning other peoples carpets and will contaminate mine. Had enough of this one, equipment away, just getting ready togo, when she comes down the drive, and says you carn't be professional carpet cleaners with that machine it's too big (450PSI ninja), my daughter has her carpets cleaned by a bloke with a much smaller machine, thats round. Oh we ask and what type of machine might that be. I'm not sure but it has got a big smily face on it! It's a george!

Best laugh we have had in ages, rolling round laughing.

I would like to call this chap with George my competition but christ what dis-service he is doing to himself. Probably spends more time filling the bloody thing up.

[Dave_Lee]

Sorry Dave, maybe you got part of the meaning in my last post slightly wrong. I wasnt commenting on you being a threat. I can only speak for myself, but Glynn and I have worked this area for the last 25 & 24 years respectfully and certainly for at least the last 20 years have not been a threat to each other, as were are both that well established, with our own group of loyal clients, that are the mainstay of our work. We have both seen many cleaners come and go in that time - nearly all a lot cheaper than either of us. Cheap, brings you customers - customers like Ive been getting rid of the last three years, and nearly all weeded out now.
Glad to hear you are dramitally increasing your prices though - I did exactly the same thing two years ago, and the majority of my loyal band are still using me. I just regret going so long, too cheap.
Now- one happy chappy.
Dave.

[John_Flynn]

If he is cleaning your bedroom at the nursing home when I visit you Dave, I'll let his Tyres down.

[Dave_Lee]

I always knew I could rely on you john - but dont kid yourself if Im still around in 24 years time and in a nursing home - you may not have far to come.
Dave, if you do come to clean my carpets then, you wont charge me too much, will you?
Dave.

[Dave_Lee]

Dave,
Damn, you beat me to it!
Dave.

[John_Flynn]

No chance of me been in the next room to Dave in the Nursing Home, 'The Good Die Young'!!

[Dynafoam]

John,

How come I'm still around then?

John.

[Len Gribble]

Dave at adl

I fully understand your enthusiasm embarking on a new venture; commercial contracts, I don’t wont to teach any one to suck eggs, but reading your post you are more or less putting all your eggs in one basket this is suicidal, expressly in the commercial sector, but I here you say I have a signed contracts, my reply hang it on the wash room wall.

I do wish you all the best.

Len

[Glynn]

Dave at ADL,
Just a little suggestion, as one experienced businessman to a young fledgling, it is not good practice to insult and be-little  one of your associates , in the manner that I have witnessed tonight on this board.

If you are serious about joining this industry as a full time professional carpet and upholstery cleaner, you have made the first step in the right direction,by purchasing and committng yourself to large amounts of money on pro eqipment, however your attitude towards other local CCs is somewhat disrespectful. You put yourself over as one who knows all, yet even I am still learning after 25 years !

Dave Lee from DeepClean and myself have operated in the same local area for 20 plus years, without causing each other any harm, and will carry on doing so in the foreseable future and if you do end up cleaning Dave's retirement room carpets , he would STILL be supplying you with cleaning tips on how to do it properly.
Lets get on together  (professionally) without dissin each other , for you can learn from all.

regards glynn

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Dave will be like a new man with his new bionic legs!

Run Forest run  

Shaun  

[Len Gribble]

Dave at adl

Reading your last post Your words “Yeah I no what you mean” I have a name so why not reply to me on this post but this sorry I don’t believe you 400 nursing homes up and down the county as well as known high street shop every 3 months etc within 6 mouths of starting your business. And VAT register I like your enthusiasm but don’t give us BS

Len

[Zach]

Hi,

Totally new to the industry, but I found this message thread very interesting.

It seems that the argument about price vs value also rages on in this industry - as it does in others.
I appreciate that I am new to this particluar industry, but I firmly believe that value (as seen from the customers perspective) is almost completely unrelated to price.

I would expect that the customer would be looking primarily to having their issues and concerns regarding the proposed job sorted out.

eg: If a carpet cleaner was called in to examine a potential job, and it was clear upon questioning the customer that their main worry was that nasty looking stain near the entrance. Then I propose that even if the whole area was cleaned to a so-so but acceptable standard - but if the stain was totally gone - that the customer would be elated with the whole job.

However, if the entire house had been cleaned to clinical standards, but if the stain remained - even partially, that the customer would be less impressed with the final result.

When customers receive what they believe to be more than they expected, through both the work carried out as well as the entire process pre and post the job, then they see value.

So, if you people are equally good at the job. Use the same equipment and chemicals etc and end up with the same visible result, I still suspect that the customer will decide that the 'better or even much better job' was performed by the cc that treated them with diginity and listened carefully to what their real concerns were.
The other cc, though equally good at going the job, may not have made as much effort with his 'customer care' and therefore may end up penalised in the customers mind - or even deemed not as professional.

Anyway, those are just my thoughts regarding this difficult issue.
BTW: Thanks for this great place. I have spent hours reading and learning much from all your contributions. One day I hope to be able to add to the knowledge.

[Derek]

Zach

Welcome to the Forum...a good first post.

You are absolutely correct as to a customer's expectations but there is one crutial ommission... that seriously offending stain may well have been tackled by the customer, long before the cleaner has been called in, with everything beneath the kitchen sink plus what could have been borrowed form neighbours and friends.

The carpet cleaner is usually called in as a last resort, expected to wave the magic wand so that the nasty stain will go away.

In the 'real world' the job of the professional cleaner is to discuss the matter with the customer and carefully explain the differences between their expectation and reality.

Cheers
Derek

[Zach]

Thanks for the reply Derek.

Yes, I agree that the customer would probably have followed that route before calling in a pro. However, as you say, depending on expectations created after discussing with the customer - value can still be built in to the process.

People generally don't expect miracles in this day and age and those that do are possibly exptecting beyond reasonable expectation.

I'd assume that anyone that comes across a customer that demands that a miracle takes place would explain the reality of the matter and then back away - instead of continuining and making the unreasonable problem theirs - as opposed to the customers.

I personally see no reason to take on someone elses problem if it will remain a problem. Though it may seem a nice thing to do at the time, I'm sure that I would then be branded as the bloke that 'destroyed' the carpet - even though they would have done that all by themselves.

Of course I am new to this industry so I may be in for a rude shock.

[Dynafoam]

Zach,

Notwithstanding Dereks' comments, you are starting out with the right approach.

When I was using a TM, one thing I missed was the relaxed chat in the kitchen whilst waiting for a bucket to fill. This was the time when I relaxed a new customer and caught up on news with  the long-tem customers.
Also at this time I explored the customers' concerns before doing a 'walk-through' of the job.

It is innitially surprising how many times you can walk into a room, and your eye goes strait to a particular stain, only to have the customer say "Don't bother about that, it always has a rug on top - now this one under the sofa....." .

Naturally I will attempt to remove all stains but knowing the customers' priority concerns can be the first step in achieving the highest level of customer satisfaction. Where time is an issue matching your own priorities to those of the customer is definately the way to go - if another issue requires more time you can always tell the customer that you will devote more time to it on the next visit.

John.

[Zach]

Hi Dynafoam,

Your comments are very interesting to me from the following perspective - please correct me where my asumptions are off the mark.

I gather that using a Truck Mount ensures better power, quicker set up times etc as its only the hose that has to be reeled back in etc.
I also gather, possibly incorrectly, that several TM users use the added power of the TM to short circuit things like pre-vacuuming due to the power available etc. Like I said I may be labouring under an illusion so no offense intended to any TM users.

The drawback of the added speed, as you say, is that the one2one with the customer may take a bit of a knock. I suspect that 'value for money' from the customers perspective includes the idea that they get plenty attention for their pound - including the chat, the careful working with their investment (ie: carpets or upholstery).

I suspect that the concept of speed is more relevant to the cleaner rather than the person paying for it. Unless of course the selling point is that speed is of the essence and that's what the customer bought into originally.

I realise that I appear to be belabouring this issue, but I figure that the customers perspective of the job to be / being carried out is even more important than the job being done itself - if that makes sense.

[Dynafoam]

Hi Zach,

I personally found that the set-up times for TMs were at best similar and sometimes worse than for a portable, dependant on the level of acess problems.

Some will argue that only the hose needs to go in but I strongly dissagree with the attitude that pre-vac'ing, agitation etc can be ignored regardless of the machine at the end of the hose.

The negative aspect of bucket-filling, I convert to a positive by creating a slightly diferent atmosphere to that which exists once the clean commences. When the 'kitchen time' is removed from the equasion the same discussions take place during the walk-through with the customer, but in a subtlely different atmosphere.

The time taken to complete the job has no real influence on the discussion because it take place before the clean begins.

John.

PS. to avoid the software putting in 'dissagreeumption', you need to write "m y a ssumption" or " my asumption"

[Dave_Lee]

Zach,
Just a quick point, especially with your reference to stains that may not come out, leading to a dissapointed client even though the rest of the carpet came up well. If you are entirely honest during the pre clean discussion or Audit/ Quote, qualified the client that the stain may not come out due to its nature, as I do, then the client will still be delighted with any improvement made. Clients are dissapointed when you over sell and under perform. If you take the stance of slightly under selling and then over performing, you will always (well nearly always) get delighted clients.
Dave.