wfp or traditional POLL VOTE

« **on:** January 15, 2006, 07:35:52 pm »

After reading mixed opinions,i thought id do this....

« **Reply #1 on:** January 15, 2006, 08:13:12 pm »

thanyou for your time

« **Reply #2 on:** January 15, 2006, 08:14:30 pm »

I use wfp and traditional, different tools for different jobs also wfp can earn you more money and you can do a lot of high rise work

Brett.

« **Reply #3 on:** January 15, 2006, 08:18:10 pm »

Just concerned about losing custom and costs.From what i have heard,it takes a few washes before the windows look good.Im still unsure about it.How about on first washes?

« **Reply #4 on:** January 15, 2006, 08:32:25 pm »

Fast One,

If you are planning to go wfp then why not do like we did. For the 3 cleans PRIOR to going wfp we cleaned our customers windows traditionally using a spray bottle of pure water and a BLADE.

We sprayed each window with water, allowed the water to start attracting the dirt and then bladed off as usual.

It seemed to have prepared the windows for the first real wfp clean, which went smoothly.

WFP every time for my hubby - he does not even take a ladder out with him now and does not do any jobs that need one for access either.

I am just more comfortable knowing that he is not climbing ladders and wont have any major accidents now.

Horses for courses though - its whateve suits you - as long as its safe.

Good luck though, regards,

Sarah

« **Reply #5 on:** January 15, 2006, 08:36:44 pm »

cheers.that doesnt seem a bad idea.

« **Reply #6 on:** January 15, 2006, 09:05:35 pm »

SARAH:Think of the insurance youve missed out of

gaza

« **Reply #7 on:** January 16, 2006, 08:13:52 am »

Hi Gaza,

Trust you to think of that one

Sarah

« **Reply #8 on:** January 16, 2006, 04:48:14 pm »

trad definetly !! you can do a beter job. eg. bird crap , fly spotting , spiders webs always a struggle with wfp . when actualy in front of the window on your ladder you know 100% that its been cleaned well . i agree with the saftey aspect of wfp and high level work but as far as doing a proper job trad will always be the best . you have to ask yourself if you werent a window cleaner and you seen the trad guy/girl(need to be pc) with ladder , bucket , blade , scrim . or you seen someone using a wfp . who would you want cleaning your windows??? and before someone out there says ,i d chose wfp because you wouldnt want to see the window cleaner fall of his ladder. well lets face it the customers prob aint too concerned about you ! they just want there windows cleaned . in this day and age people want the best service possible and im sure comparing the two , wfp and trad . people will go for trad.

« **Reply #9 on:** January 16, 2006, 08:07:07 pm »

Well said that man! I'm not alone....

I see why people want wfp, but they'll never be as thorough as us.
This is why in the future customers will seek out guys like us, and we can name our price.

Also judging by this forum it's nothing but problems.

Away from this forum no-one else really seems to use wfp.
I'm very well travelled and I've only seen 3 people EVER using wfp and two of them are moderators on here.

Says it all really...

Rog.

« **Reply #10 on:** January 16, 2006, 08:23:04 pm »

well said mr reid, couldn't have put it better myself!

« **Reply #11 on:** January 16, 2006, 09:07:06 pm »

I started using WFP, the main reason was the fact I could not use a squeegee and for safety reasons. I wanted to provide the best service I could from day one. I did not want to loose customers through my inability to use a squeegee properly. One of my first customers sacked is last 3 window cleaners because they were rubbish. I still clean is windows after six months and he as recommended me to other people.
Also I have a few customers were their previous window cleaners always dumped them after a few washes, not because they were bad payers. It was because they had leaded and Georgian windows also difficult access. As their round built up they must have dumped them for easier work? WFP is ideal for these properties.
I have got to learn to use the squeegee properly and I do practise but there is a long way to go before I can say I am competent and able to clean windows to a high standard with a squeegee. I will get there because if you want to earn a decent living and survive you will need to use both methods.
While I am learning to use the squeegee in private, I can still earn and build my reputation up by using WFP and start to build a good customer base up.
I did not vote because you need to be able to use both methods

« **Reply #12 on:** January 16, 2006, 10:52:09 pm »

Alot of people i have spoken to dont rate it.But as a business, it should be there as an option i reckon.Cant seem to talk my mate into it though.Is it worth hiring just for occasional domestic work where traditional isnt possible?If so how much does it cost to hire?

« **Reply #13 on:** January 18, 2006, 07:55:34 pm »

Quote from: fast one on January 15, 2006, 07:35:52 pm

After reading mixed opinions,i thought id do this....

After my early WFP starting up problems I would have said trad. I have rapidly acquired a taste for WFP though and now do very little trad work. I feel that I'm just starting to turn the corner with WFP and can see the day coming soon when I will be a lot faster on most jobs. I do find WFP harder work though - unlike many here. It may be because my arm muscles are still adapting.
A large part of it for me has been about getting myself organised properly.
I made a good move recently. Now that I have a higher payload van to hold the water tank, the van is also higher. I bought a set of telesteps (telescopic ladder) that I keep inside the van to save a long reach getting the others off the top. I wouldn't use telesteps as a high workload tool but they are great for the odd flat roof and to enable me to lean over gates to undo bolts etc.

« **Reply #14 on:** January 18, 2006, 08:35:34 pm »

I would have to say, if I was a Customer. And I saw someone cleaning windows Trade, and someone using WFP.
I would have to say WFP looks alot more professonal. If it cleans better or not.

And I always ask the Customer if they are happy with there Windows. Never had a NO yet.

« **Reply #15 on:** January 18, 2006, 09:40:39 pm »

squeeky the fossil

squuky a little knowlege is dangerous why comment on something you know nothing about or even tried?

I would put my wfp work up against your trad anytime,does your windows need doing every 4 weeks? mine dont,just do them to keep the money coming in.

tongue in cheek GAZA

« **Reply #16 on:** January 19, 2006, 11:29:07 am »

Gaza

did'nt see you using your rojak and ladder mitts this morning

pay 200 pound and go to jail

:

Brett

« **Reply #17 on:** January 19, 2006, 11:50:21 am »

im with gaza on this one.
bird crap and spiders webs arent left on any of the windows i clean.
you need to know what your doing.
i would put my pole work up against anyones trad method any day, if they know how to squeegee properly the results would be identical,only difference being that i would of rolled a fAg and been sat in my van half way through my cup of coffee before they had finished round the back!!!

:

« **Reply #18 on:** January 19, 2006, 12:20:22 pm »

looks like wfp is winning the vote........

« **Reply #19 on:** January 19, 2006, 03:59:17 pm »

Quote from: fast one on January 19, 2006, 12:20:22 pm

looks like wfp is winning the vote........

Well it would be on the forum here, as they've all got the idea from each other and copied their mates.

Aside from the forum people, I've only ever seen 2 window cleaners with wfp in the whole country.

Quote from: brett walker on January 19, 2006, 11:29:07 am

Gaza

did'nt see you using your rojak and ladder mitts this morning

« **Reply #20 on:** January 19, 2006, 05:53:54 pm »

Quote from: genesis_windows on January 19, 2006, 11:50:21 am

im with gaza on this one.
bird crap and spiders webs arent left on any of the windows i clean.
you need to know what your doing.
i would put my pole work up against anyones trad method any day, if they know how to squeegee properly the results would be identical,only difference being that i would of rolled a f*g and been sat in my van half way through my cup of coffee before they had finished round the back!!!
:

why oh why has the word fAg been censored!!!!?
i certainly wasnt suggesting that i was rolling a homosexual in the van!!!!!

the word crap isnt censored but "fAg" is. Hilarious

« **Reply #21 on:** January 19, 2006, 06:13:44 pm »

It's ok to roll a crap in your van.

« **Reply #22 on:** January 19, 2006, 06:38:30 pm »

Quote

Well it would be on the forum here, as they've all got the idea from each other and copied their mates.

Aside from the forum people, I've only ever seen 2 window cleaners with wfp in the whole country.

I haven't seen many people using it either Squeaky. Apart from myself using it on domestic and some light commercial, I have only seen companies using it on commercial contracts.
I have discussed it with a few window cleaners who i meet around and they all seem to see the pitfalls and none of the advantages. I can't say too much though because I was very sceptical at first too. It didn't seem to make sense that a brush could give as good or even better finish than a rubber blade. I researched it thoroughly and spent a bit of time working with people before spending my money (sorry - that should read the bank's money)

) .
I've only made the transition in recent weeks and it can still be a struggle at times but I'm glad I made the switch even though I'm only just beginning to see some benefits.
I'm not looking forward to the predicted freeze-up next week though. Might have to get my ladders and some screenwash out for that.

« **Reply #23 on:** January 19, 2006, 10:23:36 pm »

BRETT:Wasnt using my ladder mits or rojak cus had lent them to squeaky so he would be extra safe

GAZA

« **Reply #24 on:** January 20, 2006, 01:22:13 pm »

Quote from: Squeaky Clean. on January 19, 2006, 06:13:44 pm

It's ok to roll a crap in your van.
[/quote
funny funny man
looking at your new van squeeky, reckon i culd shoe-horn a 250ltr system in there, interested??

« **Reply #25 on:** January 20, 2006, 11:26:51 pm »

I do find WFP harder work though - unlike many here. It may be because my arm muscles are still adapting.

Trust me, you're doing it wrong - look at the size of your thigh muscles (quadruceps) compared to the size of your arm muscles (bi + triceps) and figure out which will do the most work for the least effort.

Use the spring/bend of the pole, combined with a rocking motion between your front and back leg to do most of the work for you, whilst keeping the pole more or less stationery because your arms don't move.

If that doesn't make sense ask someone who's been wfp'ing for a while to show you or do a search for wfp videos

If it helps, we get a reduction on our EL + PL because we use wfp, but we'll never be 100%. Consider it as another string to your bow, not the be-all and end-all of window cleaning.

HTH

« **Reply #26 on:** January 22, 2006, 07:36:43 pm »

i have been using wfp for the last year,long before i found this forum,have been really surprised how many of us use wfp.

« **Reply #27 on:** January 22, 2006, 10:05:38 pm »

I prefer WFP and 95% of my work is done with the WFP.

The other 5% done by ladders for various reasons.

Like a long walk from the van and they have a flat roof or locked gate,
In these cases there is no way i could manage my trolley poles's and ladder so now just grab the ladder for these.

Also some ali frames that are oxidised are done by ladders.
And some done by ladders because it a lot quicker on that particular job.

But at the end of the day i prefer WFP

Paul

« **Reply #28 on:** January 22, 2006, 10:46:27 pm »

Quote from: WavieDavie on January 20, 2006, 11:26:51 pm

I do find WFP harder work though - unlike many here. It may be because my arm muscles are still adapting.

Trust me, you're doing it wrong - look at the size of your thigh muscles (quadruceps) compared to the size of your arm muscles (bi + triceps) and figure out which will do the most work for the least effort.

Use the spring/bend of the pole, combined with a rocking motion between your front and back leg to do most of the work for you, whilst keeping the pole more or less stationery because your arms don't move.

If that doesn't make sense ask someone who's been wfp'ing for a while to show you or do a search for wfp videos

If it helps, we get a reduction on our EL + PL because we use wfp, but we'll never be 100%. Consider it as another string to your bow, not the be-all and end-all of window cleaning.

HTH

What you say about the "rocking motion" makes perfect sense. I've even seen it demo'd too. I find that I keep having to force myself into doing it that way - even though it is clearly better. The only times I have to do it from the arms are when I'm having to work right underneath a window due to a boundary fence or similar. Also, if I'm having to hold the pole at a more horizontal angle due to a flat roof/conservatory. Apart from the above, there is no good reason to put the strain onto my arms - it's just about learning new habits.
Thanks for the tip.

Poll

preference:wfp or traditional?