[easycleaner]

Had a sky dish fitted today, got chatting to the fitter and he said he had been on ladder use courses and you must us non slip feet, and fix an eyebolt to tie the top of ladder to, on every job. He reconds under every window to be within the law, or you could get nicked by HSE.
What do you think or what is the law? and how can I find out?
Mart.

[M & C Window Cleaning]

How are you supposed to fit the eyebolt?

[kirky]

i saw two blokes cleaning a shop front a while ago,they were using a pointer (A ladder) one bloke was two rungs up the other was footing it wearing a hard hat..what the fook you two doing i said.. company policey came the reply...it was laughable but its the way we are going due to health and saftey laws.

one of my custies is an health and saftey officer he tells me that from next year they are pushing for a law thats states if a window can be cleaned from the ground it must be cleaned from the gound i.e if a pole can reach it a ladder is ilegal.

[cat9921]

i saw two blokes cleaning a shop front a while ago,they were using a pointer (A ladder) one bloke was two rungs up the other was footing it wearing a hard hat..what the fook you two doing i said.. company policey came the reply...it was laughable but its the way we are going due to health and saftey laws.

one of my custies is an health and saftey officer he tells me that from next year they are pushing for a law thats states if a window can be cleaned from the ground it must be cleaned from the gound i.e if a pole can reach it a ladder is ilegal.

I hope not, as I think you need both Trade and WFP...  :

[easycleaner]

The bloke from sky said you have drill under each window and fix an eye bolt. I think HSE wants access only for ladders as it is in industry.
Mart

[TennetClean]

I hate to say I told you so, but...

[kris martin]

i knew you were right tennent but its not gonna stop people climbing, i wont stop climbing but to say ive gone from climbing about 300 times a day to at the most 5 but more often than not 0, i tell you anybody who is wondering eather or not to change because it is so much better getting up in the morning TRUST ME, dont get rid of the ladders but go wfp, i love it....

[MJH]

I have seen plenty of sky fitters and advertising board men in my area working of ladders with helmets, and harnesses, the ladders are always properly secured too!!!

[kris martin]

i have been told 3 times in 2 weeks that sky men have to bolt the ladder into the wall every climb and then fill the hole in afterwards..

[MJH]

i have been told 3 times in 2 weeks that sky men have to bolt the ladder into the wall every climb and then fill the hole in afterwards..

I think HSE seem to police sky fitters more than wcs, around the corner from my house there is an official working at height training centre and its main custs are from the sky sector, perhaps they need to be certificated!! not sure!

[kris martin]

i know there are a lot of rules and regulations, one of my customers works for health and safety and told me going too wfp is the best thing you could of done... if health and safety seen what some of us wc do on ladders they would have kittens because we have all done a daft thing or 2.3.4.5..

[Franky2020]

Are these HSE people going to be on every street corner,get real people.

[jewelcleaning]

So he has to go up the ladder, wielding a drill, to drill a hole and fit an anchor point, to secure himself later, when he goes up the ladder again?

[james44]

Ok so you climb a ladder to access a window to clean it,

time taken 20sec how long do you have to be on a ladder for them to redeem it a working  platform

[karlosdaze]

Last time I looked: you need a certification to fit safety eyebolts. 
Read the working at height guidelines. Short durations have no restrictions for window cleaners.
It made sence to wear a hard hat in this situation because of falling debris. Satellite fitting is a totally different game to window cleaning.
HSE will never ban ladders.

[dave0123]

When SKY come and fitted our sky they drilled the hole for the eye bolt about 4 foot up the wall tied it off. but they also had anti sleep feet and a stablizer at the top of the ladder.

the user had a hard had on and a harness on which was connected to the ladder... it really did look like he was about to do some rock climbin  :. btw the dish is only 13 foot high.

[mr D]

oh my god there are too many jobs worths in this country!!!

the reason sky fitters have to drill holes is because there staff use any excuse to fall off and sue sky because there a mega million pound company! covering there asses nothing to do with the HSE. people throw the HSE around far to much!

I do this because the HSE say i have to. lol please give me a break guys!

you fall from a lader from 1st floor whering a hard hat... hat falls off your more likely to break a leg that your head any way. your whering a safty harnes.... you hit the floor b4 your lanyard pulls! the way to stop falling from a ladder is know how to climb in in the 1st place. training is the only answer IMO.

[TennetClean]

it doesn't matter how much you might dislike it, its the law, like i have been saying for weeks.

if your using a ladder this is the palavour you have to go through, therefore ladder monkey window cleaners are illegal unless they do it (which they dont).

yet for some reason i get atacked when i say that.  seems to me some people would rather burry their head in the sand.  smart idea, not.  As the man above rightly said, CCTV is everywhere now.

[TennetClean]

I am not saying ladders are against the law, but if you use em you have to secure em, like these sky people do.

"show me where parliment has passed the law" LOL ignorance.  Google "work at height regulations 2005" and you'll see it.  These are not guidelines, they are regulations, ie if you break em you are working illegally.

We had this argument a few weeks back on here.  I was right then, I am still right now, but numpties would rather attack me than face the facts.  Unless you secure you ladder, you are breaking the law.

Its that simple.

[TennetClean]

No offense matey, but I am not gonna argue about this all over again.  The last time I did, I found the stupidity that came out from people to be rather depressing.

By saying that you think that regulations are not the law you are showing how much you know about the subject, IE nothing.

My advise to you would be, continue to ignore the law, continue to ignore the facts and live in a fantasy dream world where nothing is against the law if you don't want it to be.

Tennetclean has left the building (or at least, has left this thread)

[kirky]

i have been told 3 times in 2 weeks that sky men have to bolt the ladder into the wall every climb and then fill the hole in afterwards..

i saw this about 2 weeks ago on a custies house

[kris martin]

I am not saying ladders are against the law, but if you use em you have to secure em, like these sky people do.

"show me where parliment has passed the law" LOL ignorance.  Google "work at height regulations 2005" and you'll see it.  These are not guidelines, they are regulations, ie if you break em you are working illegally.

We had this argument a few weeks back on here.  I was right then, I am still right now, but numpties would rather attack me than face the facts.  Unless you secure you ladder, you are breaking the law.

Its that simple.

people were attacking you not because of the facts but because of what you say you'll do (grass to HAS) when it wouldnt affect you in the slightest what others do...

[L.J.Thorpe]

if ladders are "ILLEGAL" then why am i paying for for insurance to use them at heights upto 6 mtrs?
work of short duration is fine if reasonable precautions are taken
toilet clean is a troll and does this to obtain reaction
just ignore
maybe one day he will hit puberty or meet a woman/man/goat and shut up

[jewelcleaning]

I am not saying ladders are against the law, but if you use em you have to secure em, like these sky people do.

"show me where parliment has passed the law" LOL ignorance.  Google "work at height regulations 2005" and you'll see it.  These are not guidelines, they are regulations, ie if you break em you are working illegally.

We had this argument a few weeks back on here.  I was right then, I am still right now, but numpties would rather attack me than face the facts.  Unless you secure you ladder, you are breaking the law.

Its that simple.

people were attacking you not because of the facts but because of what you say you'll do (grass to HAS) when it wouldnt affect you in the slightest what others do...

I'll second that, tennet you were saying you were going to "hunt down" those who work from ladders and calling them "ladder monkeys"

I do agree though that the ladders have to be secured at the top and bottom, and most people don't.

Those ladder legs look really good.  Can't remember the link now, but they can slide up and down the stiles to requires height and then lock where needed.

j

[charltoc]

TennetClean  why are you so angry and agressive when you post - were you bullied as a child and this is your way of throwing your weight around ( behind pc )

please take a chill pill or post in a less angry way still stating your facts - the way you go on you would think god put you on this place planet to fight the injustice of traditional window cleaners 

have read numerous posts and you irrate a far few..

p.s. hope you had a nice relaxing weekend 

[Bobs Window Cleaning]

This subject gets more confusing (to me anyway) with every post.

I still use ladders to get on flat roofs without securing them......am I breaking the law? (I use wfp on tops only at the mo)

I never clean windows off double ladders but still use my 6ft pointer for windows just out of reach.....am i breaking the law?

I thought you should use WFP if you can afford it, a viable alternative innit......lots of cleaners cant afford it. That doesn't mean they should be tagged with such venom that they seem to.......especially on here.

Is it that black and white or am I having a blonde moment?


Bob

[L.J.Thorpe]

bob
not at all mate
i still trad old leaky 18th century windows
why? because wfp makes water pour through onto antique furniture and carpets
my argument for this is that wfp is NOT a viable alternative in this case
so is THAT illegal
i will wait for a vist from the h+s boys

[Simon_King]

I was under the impression that if you use a standoff on the top of your ladder especially the Microlite standoff then you are classed as being secured at the top.
The rubber wheels on the microlite flatten out to anchor you to the wall. If you use a Rojack ladder stopper at the bottom your secure top and bottom AND you have room to work at the top as you are away from the wall/window. Most local authourity workmen use them on their ladders and if council workers are allowed up ladders to work then surely Sky fitters and window cleaners can too!
By the way I'm water fed but dont want ladders banned as I use them as well.We just need to work safely and use the right equipment. Hopefully common sense will prevail.

[windowwashers]

this must be a new thing for sky fitters, I had one round here 1 year ago he used a ladder and nothing else, I footed it for him as it was windy as hell (I got extra cables and a few other thing for helping the guy) he did not ask me to foot but I did not want bllod on my new patio and he could have damaged my new fence, also I have a heart.

Have this just changed ??

[jewelcleaning]

This subject gets more confusing (to me anyway) with every post.

I still use ladders to get on flat roofs without securing them......am I breaking the law? (I use wfp on tops only at the mo)

I never clean windows off double ladders but still use my 6ft pointer for windows just out of reach.....am i breaking the law?

I thought you should use WFP if you can afford it, a viable alternative innit......lots of cleaners cant afford it. That doesn't mean they should be tagged with such venom that they seem to.......especially on here.

Is it that black and white or am I having a blonde moment?


Bob

Thats like saying a plumber won't get corgi registered because he can't afford it.

[Bobs Window Cleaning]

I thought it was gas men who needed to be corgi registered not plumbers.

Anyway I dont want to start a arguement on here. Its just so confusing

I think yer right Ewan.....we/they  use ladders for short durations

Bob

[Simon_King]

Whats the betting the HSE will turn on hoses on paths, vans parked wrongly and long poles used in a public place next. Not to mention 25 litre drums being 5KG too heavy to lift!
AND DONT GET EM STARTED ON MUSCLE STRAIN ON NECK AND SHOULDERS!

[jewelcleaning]

I thought it was gas men who needed to be corgi registered not plumbers.

Anyway I dont want to start a arguement on here. Its just so confusing

I think yer right Ewan.....we/they  use ladders for short durations

Bob

Ok gas fitters then, but you know what I mean.

I'm not trying to argue either..

I acctually voiced the same question (about affording WFP system) to a HSE officer at Windex.  He replied: I can't say too much at the mo, but watch this space.

Dunno what this meant, but hopefully we'll find out soon!!

Remember, some numpties do put their lives and others' at risk whilst using ladders, and that's what the directives are there to try to sort out.

IMO of course!!!!!!

 

[Bobs Window Cleaning]

Sooner we find out the better

[jewelcleaning]

Sooner we find out the better

Have you had a look through the work at height directives from hse?  They're on hse website. www.hse.gov.uk/falls/ladders.htm  On this page you'll find a link to a brief guide to the wahr.