[utopiacleaning]

Hi guys

My god this is doing my head in.  Never done this before so any advise would be grateful.


We clean the communal areas for an estate Managerment Company, who have offered us this new site due to the fact that there have been numerous complains about the clean and they haver had enough. 

The thing is they have written a letter to the current cleaner stating that they are barring the cleaner from any of their sites.  Also when i received the tupe inforamtion from the current cleaners there are two of them on there.  No i have just spoken to my Estate Management company who has informed me that under their contract there should only be one cleaner.

So my thinking was this as i have to take them on, can i either state that due to the fact the client no longer wants them on site, i have agreed with them to supervise them, but to enable me to do this they will have to work different hours.  (They currently do 8-10 pm) i want them to do 5am - 7 am.  Or can i transfer them to another site.   

I feel like my hands are tied.  I am worried as a friend who has a cleaning company got sued £9000.  It makes you fell is it really worth it.

Any responce would be really good.  Cheers

[Gerry Styles]

Tupe is a minefield. check out this website

www.direct.gov.uk/en/Employment/Employees/RedundancyAndLeavingYourJob/DG_10026691

[garyj]

You cannot change their working hours or conditions under TUPE. But if the client has written saying they do not want them on any of their sites then there is such a thing as client pressure which will enable you to get rid of them. Sounds like if you put them somewhere else then they would be trouble there too. How long have they been working at the site?

[Colin Stokes]

We have done this recently on a similar site and at the outset we HAD to take them on on the same terms and conditions and this includes working hours.  The only saving grace for us was that we also inherited their HR files and disciplinarys received.  You might be lucky that previous employer issued warnings and they may be near to dismissal anyway or that their contracts say either hours are flexible or place of work can be changed.  Have you seen their contracts yet?  If no contract then you may be in a slightly stronger position.

Eventually we have managed out the staff due to the previous warnings an terms of their original contract.

We are a small company of around 20 employees and dont have our own HR people so now, for a fixed monthly fee of around £100 we contract an HR company who answer as many enquiries as we have then charge extras for attending meetings/disciplinary's etc.  We find it's more than worth it.

[utopiacleaning]

Hi Gary

they have only been working there since feb 08

[Gerry Styles]

From the directgov website

You have the right to a redundancy payment if you're an employee who has worked continuously for your employer for at least two years. Statutory redundancy pay isn't taxable.

Redundancy pay is also due when a fixed-term contract of two years or more expires and is not renewed because of redundancy.

[Fox]

As the cleaners have not had continuous employment for over twelve months regardless of TUPE their employment is not as secure, you are well within your rights to serve a weeks notice to this pair without any other reason than they are not suitable for the position you can either pay them in leiu or let them work it and don't forget any holiday accrued.  Act now before problems become bigger.

Fox

[Jonny jones]

hi heres another one

ok i know you must honour the holidays and working hours,  but what about their hourly rate.

thanx jonny

[utopiacleaning]

I know that one.  You have to keep to the pay that they receive

[Jonny jones]

hi

i think this is a very unfair ruling, i feel that businesses like ours can not give a competative tender on most jobs,  in my area the council has just a pay review and im starting to get a lot of people who are currently using the council cleaners, ive heard that the pay review will be giving the cleaners up to nearly £7 per hour depending onnyour job, ie supervisors etc.

plus thier hidden extras,  like the sick pay, they give you full pay for six months and then half after 6 mnths, 
holidays at 32 days not inc bank hols

tupe what a headache

thanx jonny