[Craig - CW Window Cleaning]

Hi there, I recently done a builders clean top to bottom outside windows covered in rendering etc.
I charged £20 per and done 7 hours solid work on one house.
Would you say that is over priced?
What would be an average houlry rate if it is over priced?

regards

craig

[Griffus]

If they paid then it wasn't overpriced.

[Neil kell]

Do you do much initial cleans with regards to glass externally? because regardless of what you charged, if there is so much as one scratch on that glass, you may well be counter charged. Builders are operating at a minus these days and will screw there subbies to the wall for anything they can. Removing things like render, mortar, cement, monachuche and even stickers takes lots of experience and if you are asking here about pricing then you may not be too used to it. Or you may be a master like myself, excuse me if so . Get that timesheet signed off fast.

[Sean Dyer]

doesnt sound too much id want half again on builders cleans there horrible compared to an hour on a commercial job or maintenance cleans

window cleaning that is, found my self in the wrong section

[Neil kell]

There is no hourly charge on a building site, unless you are into recleans or variations towards the end of the job. On a site you tender a price with ten or fifteen other companies. You would do an initial walk around, through the site and experience will tell you where you may lose time or is something is out of character. But you don't walk in and say right were here to clean, were on hourly and off you go. We'd all be millionaires if that were so. Builders cleans are very risky, I avoid them now, unless its for a civil engineering main contractor, a school or a hospital, prison etc. No way would I do a residential. Not that I have any fear of that here now.

Neil

[gordonswindows]

Have to agree with Neil

It a quote that wins builders cleans then it is up to you to bring it in on time on budget and wih a profit

Hourly rate on windows ? I would still be there

Gordon

[Sean Dyer]

Have to agree with Neil

It a quote that wins builders cleans then it is up to you to bring it in on time on budget and wih a profit

Hourly rate on windows ? I would still be there

Gordon

Yeah but if its 4 hours work you can quote at 1 hour and get the job but no amount of working hard will make it pay, youve got to have a hourly rate in mind and roughly work out how long it will take x that rate??

[gordonswindows]

Nope sorry Sean you still don't get it

you need to know how much you want to make on the job TOTAL

Hourly rate blah, have you never heard of "extras" ?

Gordon

[Sean Dyer]

Nope sorry Sean you still don't get it

you need to know how much you want to make on the job TOTAL

Hourly rate blah, have you never heard of "extras" ?

Gordon

yeah they act dont they

what extras on a builders clean for windows?id price it simply at time it takes x amount i want to earn per hour, job done
whether its the amount per job, hourly rate, number of grains of sand on sea shore / pi x days of the week +6 , im not bothered as long as it meets the amount i want per hour, whats the use of pricing x and then realising it is gonna be well below your hourly rate and then earning less, or rushing the job and sacrificing the quality

im talking purely about cleaning windows by the way i dont clean interior,  what you gonna throw in extra with a window clean it is what it is

im genuinely interested in where you are coming from, if you have some better way of pricing, but i just think you are describing essentially what i am saying but differently....

im all ears to you

[Gilbert Sprous]

I think Sean and Gordon have a little mis communication going on here.  When pricing a job it will always come down to how long you think it will take, you cant just throw out a number.  But, when quoting you give a final price, not "I will charge you this much per hour".  Then it is up to you to meet or exceed your initial expectations.  I have quoted jobs at 15 pounds per hour from my extimate but it has taken me half the estimated time so in reality I made 30 pounds per hour.  I always try to leave my self some breathing space in my quotes in case I did miss something, but so far knock on wood, I have always met of beat my initial estimate.  The question is 20 pounds per hour too much can get a different answer from many people.  Are you adding chemicals, equipment, and travel costs on top of that or are they included in the cost.  I know I am stating the obvious but a place with a marble floor costs a lot more to clean than a carpeted floor, not only for the specialised labour but for the chemicals and equipment needed.  Basically, I think Sean and Gordon are on the same track just explaining it different. 

Cheers

Gilbert

[gordonswindows]

Thank you Gilbert

That was an excellent balanced explanation. It is not quite what I meant but it is close enough thank you

If ever ACAS need a deputy I will pass on your details

Cheers

Gordon

[Phild]

Yes, nice comment Gilbert. You always add a wider viewpoint. Somehow you should explain your history and 'over the pond' viewpoint where service is more appreciated / important than here... but that's your business :-)

Builders cleans are a science in themselves. We do them nationally from little domestic jobs where the builders are only handing over a couple of units a week (local fill-in jobs to keep staff covering their wages) to cleaning chains of shops / banks / whatever being refurbed all around the country, colleges, hospitals, schools. Jobs that last a week, a month a year.

At the end of the day it comes down to how well you know your customer runs a site, his employers financial status on that job and overall then most important of all PAPERWORK. Agree what your're doing from the begining and the flow of work ( how many visits over how long) Anything different to that discuss till the cows come home and argue about but when you have agreed what you are doing'extra' to your original agreement write it down, head it 'Confirmation of verbal instruction' get them to sign it then do it. When you raise your bill raise a separate invoice for the original order and every separete 'confirmation of verbal orders' . You mustn't do ANYTHING asked for verbally without a CoVI. If you do? Quite simply you either won't get paid for it or you will spend longer chasing your money than your profit margin is worth. By raising separate invoices you stop them disputing a £20k bill for the sake of a thirty quid extra whatever.

All the comments re glazing are also true. We have had too many building companies try it on when the project goes negative financially. The answer? Simple photos discreetly taken before you start plus PAPERWORK yet again if you spot anything untoward and BEFORE you start cleaning (or as soon as cleaning shows you the slightest scratch on glazing or frames)

I hope this doesn't come over as Negative Ned stuff. Gilbert has got me on a hobby horse as I get sick of seeing new subbies who think they have landed in the Promised Land being screwed by construction contractors who, just like us, are trying to survive but they do it at the expense of a lot of 'small guys'.

Phil D

[Neil kell]

Nope sorry Sean you still don't get it

you need to know how much you want to make on the job TOTAL

Hourly rate blah, have you never heard of "extras" ?

Gordon

yeah they act dont they

what extras on a builders clean for windows?id price it simply at time it takes x amount i want to earn per hour, job done
whether its the amount per job, hourly rate, number of grains of sand on sea shore / pi x days of the week +6 , im not bothered as long as it meets the amount i want per hour, whats the use of pricing x and then realising it is gonna be well below your hourly rate and then earning less, or rushing the job and sacrificing the quality

im talking purely about cleaning windows by the way i dont clean interior,  what you gonna throw in extra with a window clean it is what it is

im genuinely interested in where you are coming from, if you have some better way of pricing, but i just think you are describing essentially what i am saying but differently....

im all ears to you

Just out of interest, who is going to do the internal, and why not get them to do the glass too. A QS doesn't want to be processing and releasing payments to 2 different cleaning firms. He wants one tax compliant subbie on site to make things easier on himself. 2 firms, twice the aggro/ paperwork etc. The best thing you can do is to pick the worst window you can find and do it free as a sample. You should be able to get at least 2 done in one hour, that including all of the balcony glass too and the decking, the down pipe, frames, tracks etc. Check it all for scratches first and point them out before you start if any, coz once you start cleaning it. Its your window now.

[gordonswindows]

Eh? We do

We do the whole property when post construction cleaning

Gordon

[Neil kell]

Eh? We do

We do the whole property when post construction cleaning

Gordon

I was referring to Sean. He said he doesn't do the internals.