[jo5hm4n]

Picked up alot of new customers already last few months and as you do, i have inherited some that are bad payers.  I'm not the best when it comes to being really efficient with outstanding payments.  Atm, i seem to have a debtlist always over £500 and some weeks close to £1000, which i think its quite high.

For the first time ever i have about 4 customers that owe me between 3-5 cleans, so i have cancelled their service, and must have called round for the money atleast 5 times.  Text reminders, called to collect as they were supposed to be online payers.  I have just signed up for the Thomas Higgins letter, because im sick of some bad payers taking me for a mug.

Can anybody recommend any other ways to get payment off those awkward customers.  Some even say right to my face, yes il pay it now online on my phone, and then they never do....

I want to get some of these people onto GoCardless so i just take the payment whenever i want.  So first question, how can i get people onto GoCardless easily?  Some people just dont want to make any effort at all to pay, i need to make it as easy as possible for them.

Second, i am slightly worried that some of my customers that are bad payers, probably have £0 in the bank on a regular basis, so that isn't really going to work as a Direct Debit if they are waiting to get paid or whatever.

I realise that i now should just drop these customers, but the thing is some of them are okay, not all bad.  Some are just difficult to get when trying to collect.  I think if i can swap them over to online in some cases it would eliminate the problem.

Just need to get stricter with accepting payment, i've been a bit rubbish lately, and it's just building up...

One more thing, with the Thomas Higgins Letter, when is it appropriate or legal to use this letter.  I'm planning on using it on 2 customers that have been told about 4/5 times they owe me money and yet they still haven't paid.  One owes £48, other £40.

I saw a post on here saying about Small Claims Court, but only if you have "proof" then you are more or less going to win the case.  What is enough proof to do this?  Alot of domestic is just verbal contracts.  If some customers never text you back, i have no written proof that they owe money, other than my daily worksheets, which show they haven't paid me, is that even enough legally?  Cba, to go to small claims court faffing about, unless i know im 100% going to win the money, otherwise would rather just write it off as a loss, rather than wasting more time.

[Stoots]

Firstly don't go more than one clean without payment.

I clean the house give them a week to pay then I send text reminders about every 3-4 days. If it gets to a few days before next clean I text to say your windows are due shortly but still not recieved payment for last clean and so are not getting done unless you pay.

From them on I would send a few more texts if no payment send a 14 day small claim letter.


Ad for proof I try to get everything in text messages.

Usually people will make up excuses via text and say sorry I'll pay soon etc. Soon as they do that they are admitting liability for the debt so you have your proof.

[SB Cleaning]

Letting it get to 4-5 cleans is utter madness mate!

If it's a customer I've had for a long while I let it go to 2 cleans then stop....if it's a new customer if they don't pay after 1 clean the service is stopped until I get paid !

[NWH]

This is the thing when you hear a lot of window cleaners say I'm picking up lots of work,it takes a few cleans but in the end you'll realise why you have,most times they've had WCs before and have almost exhausted the local cleaners. If i ever pick up a new job I get a gut feeling sometimes that tells me troubles looming with these people they start off having it done regular and paying  on time then the messing about starts. Sometimes you have to accept it when certain areas are boxed off it's not always about the money.

[NWH]

It depends on how long you've known that customer quiet often I've had £70 jobs go to 5 cleans without payment,I see them they alpologise and pay me. You can smell it when someone's skint.

[Dave Willis]

Worst payers seem to be the ones who are nicest to your face. Once or twice I have threatened to pass their debts on to an agency. Seems to work, then I dump them.

[The Jester of Wibbly]

Yes make sure they don't get away with it. Don't allow new customers another clean if not paid.

5 clean  is silly sorry. But this is why they think they can keep ripping off window cleaners  one after another especially if you let them get away with it.  Window cleaners are easy prey for the dishonest few when we just let it happen.

If they ignore your reminders then text them politely that you intend to collect in person as the debt has not been paid which will incur an additional  x charge for time and fuel.

Final stage would be to message them detailing the outstanding amount explaining it will be handed over to your legal partner on x date if unpaid. Advise them there would be a £45 handling charge added once the dept is handed over to the legal company.

You will be surprised how quick the money gets paid.

Lastly... drop them.

[Marc Stock]

Right.

Let's get a couple of things straight. You are a fool for doing the work in the 1st place, the householder who hasn't paid you yet must think you have a really good sense of humour. 2nd your better off taking a cap, sitting in front of MacDonalds and begging as at least you will get some immediate cash flow.

A customer is not a customer until they have paid you. You should never do another clean unless they have paid for the last. I take this stance on all my customers even if i have been doing them for years and years. No doshy? No washy!

[NWH]

I've had some silly window cleaning debts but always got paid in the end,lets not forget a lot of wealthy people have no concept of debt because they have none,the thought that they might owe you 1-200 quid isn't at the forefront of there mind. A lot of new money people are like this the old money types always pay on time.

[JandS]

I have some that go 4 or 5 times before payment but always pay and  then pay a couple up front so no problem.
Never really had a messer payment wise.

[dazmond]

new customers who havent paid and you ve cleaned their windows 3-5 TIMES?

ill go to 3 cleans owing on some cheap well established customer accounts,usually twice though before i stop cleaning until payment received.i wouldnt do it for a new customer though!one clean, one payment.

my debt list too is usually between £500-£1000 at any one time.(its currently at £767-00)but i know its just part of my "rolling debt" and ill get it eventually.its very rare its below £500.

i offer BACS,standing order,SAE and cash collection(only on compact estate work).

debt is part and parcel of running a window cleaning business.at least its not thousands outstanding like some other tradesman(builders,plumbers,etc).it could be worse!

also the total outstanding debts for the WHOLE YEAR i  end up writing off are usually under £100!

[NWH]

TBH I quiet like being owed a bit it comes in bit by bit

[windowswashed]

I leave a note on the invoice to say windows haven't been cleaned today as you owe for two cleans and have had to temporarily stop my services until payment received in full, If they are a dodgy new customer collect the money and never let them go past one clean without a reminder again as they normally turn out to be bad payers. Anyone who says they can't do bank transfers or cheques, only cash who are out working tend to be the pain in the ass ones not worth bothering with. If I think someone is dodgy they only get one clean and then a reminder to pay and will leave cleaning even if due until payment first to decide if they are worth the risk 

[NWH]

Actually I have 1 customer who owes me 3 £40 cleans,out of all my work I dislike her the most she turned up last time new she owed me 2 lots and said I'll pay for 3 cleans tonight. Last time she paid me was probably before Xmas lol.

[AuRavelling79]

New customers - once only.

Existing customers with a good record - twice rarely (maybe they've been on hols or forgot) so they get a bill for two lots. That is the maximum.

[Soupy]

You lot seem to be taking this very personally. 9 out of 10 of these people are just lazy, forgetful and/or skint, it's very rare you get someone who is deliberately ripping you off. Maybe down your way people aren't as nice. As a kid I was always told English people were modded, maybe that's right after all?

 

Don't worry about the actual legalities of going to court 'cause guess what; you won't. Send the letters threatening legal action, some will pay, some won't. Write off the debt and move on with your life.

Oh yeah, nearly forgot, don't clean someone 5 times without payment, it's just silly.

[Ian101]

bad / non payers are not customers - they will drain you time wise and financially.

one clean max .... no payee no cleanee  unless well established like that one on forest walk that used to pay me every 6 months.

hope its none off my old customers 

bob plumb who comes on here occasionally only takes on new customers who set up go cardless and wont even clean the first time until it has been set up .... talking to him yesterday and this week out of the 5 new enquiries 2 admitted it was just a one off.

Personally if I was to go residential window cleaning ever again then I would do the above ref go cardless for every customer plus there is another guy from Chester called iSparkle - Richard Speech who has several hundred customers ALL on an alternative to go cardless which works the same as go cardless so if he can do it so can you.

As for customer having no money in account not much you can do about this as you will still get mugged off occasionally however you will now have proof and all the details for a Thomas higgons letter.

[Dry Clean]

There's no need to be a drama queen over things like this as the majority of customers will pay without problems and
as long as you only clean once and get paid before cleaning again then your never going to get overly stung and put yourself in
the position of having to waste time money energy and wellbeing chasing the debt.
To the op, try a few things such as a Thomas Higgins letter and the threat of the small claims to see if that will push them into paying, if not let it go forget about it and concentrate on building your round, learn by your mistake , don't keep cleaning for non payers.

[JandS]

Not new customers existing customers.

[JandS]

And what exactly is gocardless.....doesn't tell you much on website.
How is it different to just setting up a d/d with a customer.

[Marc Stock]

And what exactly is gocardless.....doesn't tell you much on website.
How is it different to just setting up a d/d with a customer.

Go Cardless is a mechanism to take payments from customers bank accounts.

The customer signs up through Go Cardless and every time you do the windows you simply take the money from thier account.

For simplicity i take all my payments on the       28th of the month

[C & S]

They are the bain of my life bad payers and time taken to chase them up.
Replace as soon as you can and then drop with a decent one.

Be ridgid, one night a week I will go through my debt list and text a reminder to everybody who has not paid since 7 days off their last clean.

Give it a week and text whoever is still outstanding a little more firmer this time.

(Make sure when you sign up a customer you get their mobile and their home number)

Then ring them next course of action.

I have one on my list atm shes a real MODDED
Should of never cleaned as my spider sense was tingling.

Never answers texts, of attempted phone calls or letter I sent . (Most likey gave me wrong numbers) Drain on my time.

Its only £25 pound she owes me. Its not alot of money HOWEVER it is money that is owed to you.
Am I going to let this lie..? I am most certianally NOT.  Its a matter of principle.
Planning on going around on a sunday morning early. Knocking loudly and waking her up. If she 'hasnt got any money on her'  which will be the most likely answer I will go around again in a fee days time again nice and early.
She will get the idea that I am NOT messing about here....boils my blood.







 

[Dave Anderson]

Think most have been through the wringer during our times doing this work.

Have been lax in the past but now its very simple... I use AWORKA and soon as it highlights a debtor i.e overdue then the emails start.

I work an 8 weekly scheduled rotation and payments are required within 7 days of invoice date i.e in my account.

Debtor is someone who is late paying upon our mutually agreed payment terms and not scheduled for a next clean - No exceptions.

Customer is someone who has no outstanding payments and is scheduled for a next clean.

Big difference between a Debtor and a Customer.... Most of these people would have a hissy fit if their wages, payments, pensions were even a day late.... I see no reason why a payment cannot be made on time these days.

Obviously a customers history will affect how you deal with them but repeat late payments is a choice they make.

As soon as I get a smell in my nose now about a customer/debtor I take immediate action to both get the money and find 2 replacements, once I find these 2 replacements I can then look back at the 'Find & Replace list' and make a decision if required.... Its all a fun game to keep me on my toes now .

Customers are not my friends, nothing wrong with being friendly, more and more I see each call like servicing my very own herd of cows, turn up, milk them and do it over again at a scheduled date.

I find little joy in window cleaning alot of the time, rather watch Netflix, eat pop-corn in my underpants to be honest.... So getting paid makes it all the more worthwhile.

[JandS]

Most of my customers I have had for 10+ years and most live no more than half a mile away but the odd one or two still go 3 or 4 times before paying but it's not a problem....never yet had to threaten any of them with debt court..... dropping people after 2 cleans with no payment would leave me with barely a round and let others in on the area I cover.

[Stoots]

Most of my customers I have had for 10+ years and most live no more than half a mile away but the odd one or two still go 3 or 4 times before paying but it's not a problem....never yet had to threaten any of them with debt court..... dropping people after 2 cleans with no payment would leave me with barely a round and let others in on the area I cover.
[/quote


Thats quite the opposite way i work.

Generally i allow one clean max, after 7 days i start reminding them, the way i see it is by the time they are next due they have likely had 3-4 reminders. If they still havent paid or at least answered then to me they are ignorant MODDED. once it gets to next clean without payment the next text they get will be to say they are on hold awaiting payment. If still no reply then next step would be debt letter. I have perhaps a handfull who i let go to 2 cleans, mainly those who pay cash and cant/wont pay online this is simply to stop me having to go out collecting it on a night, but even then after 2 cleans i would be chasing that money before another clean.

You need to keep a rein on it imo as cash flow is important

[Ian taf]

Yes, we all pick up those bad payers. Most of the time they've been ditched by other window cleaners, but if they haven't paid after one month, even after all the texting and messaging etc, then they aren't  going to pay up!
if the matter continues, simply ditch them, which is what I do.
I use GoCardless, which is ok, but the customer can cancel the authorisation to pay you, so it isn't a sure bet. I now prefer to use IZettle card reader, which is ideal for those customers who say they don't have cash. No more excuses, it takes credit cards and debit cards, either by customer using their pin, or if the amount is under £30, its contactless. No more sorry will pay you when I have cash or other excuses now. Works a treat.
Check out IZettle acrd reader which cost a mere £35 to purchase.

[tony day]

Picked up alot of new customers already last few months and as you do, i have inherited some that are bad payers.  I'm not the best when it comes to being really efficient with outstanding payments.  Atm, i seem to have a debtlist always over £500 and some weeks close to £1000, which i think its quite high.

For the first time ever i have about 4 customers that owe me between 3-5 cleans, so i have cancelled their service, and must have called round for the money atleast 5 times.  Text reminders, called to collect as they were supposed to be online payers.  I have just signed up for the Thomas Higgins letter, because im sick of some bad payers taking me for a mug.

Can anybody recommend any other ways to get payment off those awkward customers.  Some even say right to my face, yes il pay it now online on my phone, and then they never do....

I want to get some of these people onto GoCardless so i just take the payment whenever i want.  So first question, how can i get people onto GoCardless easily?  Some people just dont want to make any effort at all to pay, i need to make it as easy as possible for them.

Second, i am slightly worried that some of my customers that are bad payers, probably have £0 in the bank on a regular basis, so that isn't really going to work as a Direct Debit if they are waiting to get paid or whatever.

I realise that i now should just drop these customers, but the thing is some of them are okay, not all bad.  Some are just difficult to get when trying to collect.  I think if i can swap them over to online in some cases it would eliminate the problem.

Just need to get stricter with accepting payment, i've been a bit rubbish lately, and it's just building up...

One more thing, with the Thomas Higgins Letter, when is it appropriate or legal to use this letter.  I'm planning on using it on 2 customers that have been told about 4/5 times they owe me money and yet they still haven't paid.  One owes £48, other £40.

I saw a post on here saying about Small Claims Court, but only if you have "proof" then you are more or less going to win the case.  What is enough proof to do this?  Alot of domestic is just verbal contracts.  If some customers never text you back, i have no written proof that they owe money, other than my daily worksheets, which show they haven't paid me, is that even enough legally?  Cba, to go to small claims court faffing about, unless i know im 100% going to win the money, otherwise would rather just write it off as a loss, rather than wasting more time.

Basically Window cleaning is sh#t! It's a job for the unwanted, that couldn't terrify the help! 

[slap bash]

I find the best way to get paid is starting from day one with a  policy what you will do when customers are lax payers. You will need to consider the area you work in. Are your customers mostly skint?  If so change you work patch. How do you ask or inform your customer of the amount owning? Some just drop a grubby card through the letter box. This does not mean business. Get an invoice book and have a rubber stamp made with your business name and address and write a proper invoice. Mimic other businesses. Have a gentle reminder card to pay.As most are just sloppy in paying. Drop these 10-14 days after you have cleaned. Keep a record of each days cleanes. So you can tick off as the pay. Expect to be paid I have seen so many on here just walk away because in the heart they don't expect payment.You have the right and should expect it. After 2 gentle reminders call and ask for the cash. This should happen before your next clean. Have a letter with a threat to take legal action. Post it or hand deliver it. I will only do a second clean if they are with me more than 6 cleans and skip a payment. Don`t let them threaten you or go to the police. THis is my policy I do with all customers. I still get bad payers but not many.  I am like a pair of wet pants for payment. I stick with it. Be a pain in their ass. Don`t let it be a pain in yours.

[Walter Mitty]

I've tightened up with this recently.  Traditionally, I've taken it easier with long standing customers.  However, a couple of these let me down a while back. If I missed her, one usually sent a cheque after two (sometimes three) cleans.  Then a few months back, when I was meant to do the fourth clean, instead I left a reminder through her door for the three cleans.  Never heard a peep from her.  Was cleaning her neighbour's place recently when sh came home so was going to call for the payment.  She drove off within two minutes (she definitely saw me too - the layout is such that she couldn't miss me).  The other one sent me a cheque the day the fourth clean was due.  I decided to drop her anyway as it's been persistent over many years.  I'm anticipating hearing more about that one as I clean a relative's place nearby.
I've been ripped off for money before, but never by someone who has been a customer for ten years.  So I've decided to gradually cull the pee takers.

[dazmond]

have you noticed its ALWAYS the same customers paying late!i only keep some of them on because their well priced and fit in with a little patch of work in that area.looking through texts to some customers and i have to remind some after EVERY clean.

luckily its only a few here and there.most are good customers who dont need reminders and pay in a reasonable time.

imagine if all our customers were as bad at paying as the few?we d all have gone out of business years ago!

[Spruce]

The job isn't completed until its been paid for by the customer. Friday night is our debt collecting night so that's how we keep on top of it.

At the moment we have 12 outstanding debts totaling £449.00
£392.00 are the total of 4 commercial jobs. I first job is for £230  which we did at the end of July. They process cheque payments at the end of the following month, ie August and we expect to receive a cheque by the 10th of September. If it doesn't appear then I'm on to it immediately.
The second commercial is a job which we get paid 2 weeks after completion, so this will be week beginning 21st of this month and expect the 3rd commercial payment in about 2 weeks time from the council. This is all programed into my head so I'm watching for them .
The 4th Commercial is a clean I do over the weekend and collect money from their petty cash during the following week - which could well be today.

The rest are residential awaiting collection/payment. If I miss them on a Friday evening then I will stop and knock when passing by.
£28.00 are usually paid by credit transfer (1 is for a clean we did Friday last week and the other 2 we did on Monday), 1 is for a school teacher who teaches in Manchester and comes home occasionally - not paid yet but no problem as he could well be away on a school trip with pupils during the summer holidays. He always drops a cheque in through the front door when he's around. - we did that job 3 weeks ago but I took the job on knowing the situation with regard to payment delays. He says he's retiring in March next year so will be around to pay on the day after that.



.

[dazmond]

The job isn't completed until its been paid for by the customer. Friday night is our debt collecting night so that's how we keep on top of it.
At the moment we have 12 outstanding debts totaling £449.00
£392.00 are the total of 4 commercial jobs. I first job is for £230  which we did at the end of July. They process cheque payments at the end of the following month, ie August and we expect to receive a cheque by the 10th of September. If it doesn't appear then I'm on to it immediately.
The second commercial is a job which we get paid 2 weeks after completion, so this will be week beginning 21st of this month and expect the last commercial payment in about 2 weeks time from the council. This is all programed into my head so I'm watching for them .
The 4th Commercial is a clean I do over the weekend and collect money from their petty cash during the following week - which could well be today.

The rest are residential awaiting collection. If I miss them on a Friday evening then I will stop and knock when passing by.

do you not offer BACS payments spruce?nearly all my commercial pay this way now as well as lots of domestic.of course i still get a few cheques here and there and cash but collecting is drastically reduced compared to a few years ago.