[Davew]

Gutter cleaning today, touched a cable ah, thats ok it's a telephone cable. Worked my way along the gutter and came to a second thicker cable that was exposed near the wall but insulated along the length. I asked a builder working next door if he thought it was a power cable and he said yes. Yikes!! would I fry if I touched that with my carbon pole???

[Jeff Brimble]

As with ladders dont go within 1 metre of any suspect cable. Carbon fibre is one of the best conductors of electric and-  yes you could fry as if you have a grip on the pole your hand muscles contract and you cannot let go. But it hasnt happened to any wfpers in the last 10 years.

[AuRavelling79]

Gutter cleaning today, touched a cable ah, thats ok it's a telephone cable. Worked my way along the gutter and came to a second thicker cable that was exposed near the wall but insulated along the length. I asked a builder working next door if he thought it was a power cable and he said yes. Yikes!! would I fry if I touched that with my carbon pole???

Are you sure it was not insulated? It may have been wound with wire to give it strength. Don't try to touch it with your pole to find out though!

[Davew]

I have no intention of finding out, but I can see how easy it would be to snag one, I think a little research may be in order on this problem. It must be the same for builders too surely they are well insulated?? I know nothing about them (yet). Where's Jeff?

[Luke Johnson]

everybody, please get these gloves, for your lifes sake http://www.lawson-his.co.uk/scripts/products.php?cat=Electricians%20Gloves

[jeff1]

I have no intention of finding out, but I can see how easy it would be to snag one, I think a little research may be in order on this problem. It must be the same for builders too surely they are well insulated?? I know nothing about them (yet). Where's Jeff?

'DONT' Just assume the cable is insulated? the IEE 16th edition states any overhead cable must be insulated, so we all presume they are :

I always do a risk assesment every time I go onto a job, this include jobs I did 6 weeks previously.
I don't know if they have had electrical work done in that time, How long does it take you to look? SECONDS! 
We don't know if our custy who is a jack of all trades and a master of non, has just added a socket to the garage and run the cable over head with out strapping it to a catenary wire that is bolted to the wall?
We don't know if he used top grade cable or cable bought from his local pound shop.

I always presume the worse, why??? because I want to stay alive as long as I can and I have no intentions of being killed by billy the bodger. DO A RISK ASSESMENT ON EVERY JOB EVERY TIME!

Ok! lets Go to the main overhead cable that feeds the house? Does it look insulated 'YES'
Thats OK then, it doesn't matter if we touch it with our poles THINK AGAIN DODO, well you may well be as extinct as a dodo, if you think like that, what if the outer sheath of the cable has broken down, by this I mean degraded or even damaged, just in the exact spot you touch it with your pole, Then Its bye-bye Mr window cleaner can I come to your funeral?

You can't see,hear or smell electricity, but thank god one of our sences works with it : TOUCH, but touch it once and it could very well be your last.

RISK ASSESMENT guy's,it  takes 2 seconds and could well save your life, only a fool breaks the 2 second rule.

You guy's who employ staff, I would seriously think about training them, this should protect them and you in case of an accident,  it always comes back to the employer. and its not only a fine you get, in most cases its a prison sentence.

[Andy@w.c.s]

Hi Jeff
I had never even thought to say to my guys about over head cables and pole
Thanks for the tips
we will now be doing a risk assesment on every job just to make sure

Thanks Mate

[quantum cleaning]

Dont trust any cable Ive a freind who works for a utility company and and some gypos were doing a gutter job and grabbed the cable as you guessed..... crispy gypo they had to cut the power to get him off  just as well it was in the day otherwise everyone would of missed Eastenders!!! dont do it lads and  ladies

[Luke Johnson]

Is anybody going to visit this site, for anti electrocution gloves up to 26,000 volts

http://www.lawson-his.co.uk/scripts/products.php?cat=Electricians%20Gloves

[jeff1]

Hi Jeff
I had never even thought to say to my guys about over head cables and pole
Thanks for the tips
we will now be doing a risk assesment on every job just to make sure

Thanks Mate

Hi Andy
See if there is any sort of training programme you could do with them, regarding the above, and get them to sign it if they pass. this way if anything was to happen, the HSE could see that you took steps to protect them as an employer, not just in overhead power cables, but putting things like warning signs out for the public etc.

[NWH]

I`m going to insulate all my fishing pole sections from the third section down,that will mean that when i use it it will always be safe.It has to be 3 sections min for me to use the fishing pole otherwise i`ll use the carbon facelift which has a fiberglass base section.

[Luke Johnson]

how do you go about insulating it? how does it work?

[NWH]

You can by it from gardiners,the same stuff that comes on the base section of the 35sl.You shrink it on by using a heat gun or paint stripper.

[Luke Johnson]

I see, so it covers over the carbon with a new surface, trouble is the electricity could arc, or jump to the next un-insulated section. You could use this method in conjunction with these gloves http://www.lawson-his.co.uk/scripts/products.php?cat=Electricians%20Gloves

[NWH]

If you wanted to you could insulate all sections if you use it at different heights all the time,but as i said unless i need at least 3 sections i stick with the carbon facelift,for 20ft or so working height that pole in the 24ft version is the dogs danglies.

[jeff1]

http://www.maplin.co.uk/Search.aspx?MenuNo=11862&MenuName=Self+Amalgamating+Tape&FromMenu=y&doy=19m6

If you use this self Amalgamating tape, it will turn your pole into rubber, well protected for those concerned.
This tape will not only insulate your poles, but keep a spare roll in your van and any holes or splits that appear in your hoses you have a fix on hand.

[Luke Johnson]

I will prob use my fishing pole for 25ft+ work, I could insulate a few sections and use the gloves. I use the pro long alu for 25ft

[Jeff Brimble]

Ok let me ask ?
if you are using say a 50 ft pole but have a non conducting sections say mid way down. You then touch a cable with the upper sections,  how does the current pass it and reach earth ? ie Bt etc use  poles for measuring the heights of wires, the poles are non conducting glass fibre, (I have one)

[Luke Johnson]

I dont understand your question Jeff, sorry

[Jeff Brimble]

Ok lets say one of the sections is a piece of 3ft wood, how does the current travel to earth through it ?

[Luke Johnson]

But electricity can arc or jump metres, so it could jump inside or outside the insulated section. You said yourself not to go within any distance of a live wire, because it can jump!

[Jeff Brimble]

So I did !
Right so it can jump, I thought about one metre, in the states they say 2 yards so having an insulated 6ft-8ft base section is by itself no use either ?
I am just trying to lay some ground rules for when to use a conducting pole and ist seems that the safe answer is never ?

[jeff1]

So I did !
Right so it can jump, I thought about one metre, in the states they say 2 yards so having an insulated 6ft-8ft base section is by itself no use either ?
I am just trying to lay some ground rules for when to use a conducting pole and ist seems that the safe answer is never ?

Jeff as I just said on the other thread the chances of being electrocuted are very slim indeed, this is all procautionary measures.

The measuring poles that BT use, I also have one, I have also been lead to believe that H&S have susspended the use of these measuring poles until further investigations have been completed because of the chance of electrocution.
Is your pole the brown one they use??

[pjulk]

You can insulate your pole but if your pole is wet the insulation will not work.

Paul

[Davew]

Thanks for replying everyone. This subject rarely seems to rear it's ugly head on this forum which I find very odd. Having been self taught and only picking up tips from this forum it never really occured to me the danger just waiting out there. Being rather naive I thought the only danger was from the rather obvious pylons that run through the countryside!! I have contacted several overhead wires in my short time with wfp time to re-acess my working practices I think!!!!!

[matt]

You can insulate your pole but if your pole is wet the insulation will not work.

Paul

exactly, pointless insulating the pole when you have water running down it

[Jeff Brimble]

Jeff, I have their brown one which is made of thin wall glass fibre, I mainly use a 4ft sectioned tapered telescopic glass fibre to 18ft-21ft and a Carbon modular F16 for higher work.

[jeff1]

You can insulate your pole but if your pole is wet the insulation will not work.

Paul

Very true paul, but with the gauntlet gloves there on about and the chainmail vests, we have the poles all's we need now is the horse, and its the knights of the round table
I was enjoying these topics but I have to get ready to go out and see my Boss, but will look in later.

[jeff1]

Jeff, I have their brown one which is made of thin wall glass fibre, I mainly use a 4ft sectioned tapered telescopic glass fibre to 18ft-21ft and a Carbon F16 for higher work.

Thats the one I have Jeff almost splits by looking at it?
But thats the one I have been told about, being put on hold, I'll try to find out a little more about it.

[kiral1404]

Overhead Power Line

The commonest lines you'll come into contact with is 240v single phase can be insulated normally black. Older wire is uninsulated copper cable looks greenish.

Trace the cable back to the main pole you should see between 3 to 5 cables depending on the network and where you are in the country.

These are 415v 3 phase sometimes they have a HV wires above (11,000v) rare but does happen.

These poles are generally BT pole size.

The next size up are 11kV upto 132kV larger wooden poles some areas metal poles / frames.

If you see these you'll likely be in the sticks edge of town etc. They do pass through towns but your gonna have to be stupid to hit one.

The wooden bit someone mentioned is no good, what they are called are paramelli inserts. (Look like wood).

These are used on earthing sets. The sections are glass fibre about 5' / 6' and have this insert near
 the bottom they are modular and very heavy def no good for wfp.

That is a brief description of overhead lines.

Above all else play safe don't go near them they may be insulated but you don't know the integrity of the insulation until it's too late.

As for arcing across yes they can but 3' on a LV service is unlikely but not impossible. Pure water should not conduct electricity but would you risk it!

PS Low voltage systems carry a far greater current hence a potential flashover will really do you some harm.

Darren
 Ex High Voltage Fitter

[Davew]

Perhaps we should post some images on here for all to see to give us all some idea of whats about.

[Jeff Brimble]

Hi Daren and folks, just bought a apir of Electricians Gloves designed for electrical purposes and comply with IEC 60903:2002 and EN60903:2003 straight out of the bag. Hope thats OK.
 
What does bother me though is that I got them to work on the main street where I live etc and then the guy starts talking about the number of signage I need to actually stand on the road surface and the application forms to fill in(footpath is ok if I have PL ins.) . But I guess thats a seperate issue.

[Davew]

Whilst we are on the subject of electrocution - would it be feasable to clean those large signs outside of petrol stations with wfp? anyone here do it?

[jouk45]

You can insulate your pole but if your pole is wet the insulation will not work.

Paul

exactly, pointless insulating the pole when you have water running down it

matt, is right, i think if a rubber product was made like this, but make the hole size and fitted to the top of the base of the pole
it could stop the water flowing down the pole, eliminating any chance of electrocution, just a thought,

[twt]

so the waters just going to get to the rubber on the pole and stop! i dont think so  its just gonna flow over it

[jouk45]

yes true, but the pole is always at an angle, the rubber guard could have a long spout moulded into it
so the water is directed away from you, as i said just a thought 

[Luke Johnson]

Jeff Brimble, did you get those gloves from the place I suggested?