[jonah]

Just reading the posts on here and it makes me glad to be on ladders and fairy ! The worst that can happen is I have run out of microfibre clothes !   

[pjulk]

or you fall off your ladder

[alanwilson]

or someone nicks your ladders

[matt]

even though ive said what i did int he other post

you would never catch me up and down a ladder again, why would i ? ?? ?  the pole does a job that most are happy with

as ive said, i still trad downstairs ( though i am moving slowley over to WFP on certain houses, but thats just greed im afraid and i do allways wonder why, then i tell myself, well other do it, but im close to ditching that idea of WFP on them all

[jonah]

Done them both !

[jonah]

I am like a ferret at the moment , up and down in record time ( I am on the abs diet and have lost 7lbs inb 2 weeks )

[[GQC] Tim]

I am like a ferret at the moment , up and down in record time ( I am on the abs diet and have lost 7lbs inb 2 weeks )

Well I'm getting fed up with going up the ladders, and my knees are knacking the whole time, and at the end of the week I can usually feel my knees, I've got weird pains, and tendons feeling like their going out of place every now and then.  And next month I'm only 24. I think I'll be happy with wfp.

[groundhog]

I am like a ferret at the moment , up and down in record time ( I am on the abs diet and have lost 7lbs inb 2 weeks )

You may be going up and down in record time, but you would still be quicker with wfp!! 

[jonah]

I am like a ferret at the moment , up and down in record time ( I am on the abs diet and have lost 7lbs inb 2 weeks )

You may be going up and down in record time, but you would still be quicker with wfp!! 

Groundhog you are a star and this forum wouldnt be the same without you !

[mr D]

it amazes me how many w/c on here dont or cant clean windows traditional

thats like driving an automatic but not being able to drive manual. one day the goverment will ban wfp then where will they be???

[chris@c.m.s]

Thats a joke yes 

[groundhog]

it amazes me how many w/c on here dont or cant clean windows traditional

thats like driving an automatic but not being able to drive manual. one day the goverment will ban wfp then where will they be???

Things move on, and wfp is a huge improvement on trad, so why would anyone want to stay in the dark ages? Move with the times my friend!!!  

Thanks for your kind words Jonah!   I have to say I agree with you entirely!!!  

[Wayne Thomas]

it amazes me how many w/c on here dont or cant clean windows traditional

thats like driving an automatic but not being able to drive manual. one day the goverment will ban wfp then where will they be???

Down the dole office signing on and out cleaning windows trad like the rest of the dole brigade, lol

[geefree]

just read the opening post with shock..

for the first time , i am going to put trad cleaning down...

i have just spent the last 2 days cleaning horrible dirty frames... never been touched....

around 50 or so houses...  wfp top... trad bottom.... and what a nightmare that was..

my mate had cleaned all the tops... front and sides...with  a water fed pole .... whilst i was cleaning the front window trad,, downstairs.... absolutley minging.......

5 small openers.. 5 large underneath... not to mention the filth above the glass.. not simply the frames either.....the plastic above also had to be done.

it simply took ages.... lots of dirty cloths... lots of hard elbow grease

but the worst part was having my mate take the pee out of me, as he had nearly done all the tops.......(same filth as the bottoms) whilst i was struggling with the dirt doing the trad way.... and i am pretty quick too...

so this morning , we went back , to carry on ... only this time ... pole top.. pole bottom....

what a joy!... what a relief!.... slish , splosh....all the dirt was gone in seconds...

i was behind him on every window...

and they were gleaming.. and we did it in  much much less than half the time....

the guys who trad on here are brilliant and hard working... god thats an understatement.....

but using a water fed pole is like winning the bloody lottery...

it does not compare at all  ...

 so , whilst i wll never post remarks to upset people,, i will in this instance say...
that the opening topic, of  a bucket and a cloth .. is ok for you, if you like that type of work... but  move on.. spend some money and help yourself .. really !...

it s the way forward... no matter what anyone says on here... the water fed pole system beats trad hands down....

we doubled our takings today...

trad masters.... please try it out... because you are missing out.

i hated the dirt , the 15 dirty cloths.. and the pointer ladder... hated it.

today was bliss...

no lies or point scoring..
 just fact.

[Londoner]

Does it really matter? Trad is best, theres no doubt about that IF its done properly. I still prefer it. But I use WFP because its quicker and easier.

Most of the customers are fine with it. About 10% don't take to it but they get dropped. Plenty more fish in the sea.

I run a business, the purpose of that business is to make money for me and my family.

Friday afternoons I pay all the money into the bank. its the figure at the bottom of the paying in slip that is important, Nothing else. 

[xxmattyxx]

I have been trad for 10 years and wfp for 2 months.

IMO WFP is liberating.

Its the best move Ive ever made in this game and just wish Id done it all before. Oh how I used to scorn the thought of it.

Until I tried it I never knew I didnt know.

[Mike 108]

Vince

I agree with you.

I do both. I am taking on more and more WFP work (despite several frustrating experiences) because it is easier and pays more.

However, I still (have to) do some ‘trad’ work and, although it takes longer, I find it to be very satisfying to be able to see, immediately, the results of a job well done.

Mike

[Kev R]

Why oh why is there this wfp verses trad bit all the time.

I am a commercial window cleaner and I use both. Different jobs require different applications. We clean a chip restaurant, wfp wont shift the grease so we use trad inside and out. most of our shops require soap to remove grease, from fingermarks on doors and hand prints on glass so if your soaping it you may as well use a squeegee!!! I also have several cleans at 40 - 60ft, wfp comes into is own there for sure.

If your a good window cleaner you use both because you have to (except just external domestic cleaners), if your stuck in the past you do trad only, but in the modern window cleaning world there is a place for both.

dont argue about it - have both and move on 

[elite mike]

I am like a ferret at the moment , up and down in record time ( I am on the abs diet and have lost 7lbs inb 2 weeks )

hope you dont smell like one?   

[windowwashers]

Why oh why is there this wfp verses trad bit all the time.

I am a commercial window cleaner and I use both. Different jobs require different applications. We clean a chip restaurant, wfp wont shift the grease so we use trad inside and out. most of our shops require soap to remove grease, from fingermarks on doors and hand prints on glass so if your soaping it you may as well use a squeegee!!! I also have several cleans at 40 - 60ft, wfp comes into is own there for sure.

If your a good window cleaner you use both because you have to (except just external domestic cleaners), if your stuck in the past you do trad only, but in the modern window cleaning world there is a place for both.

dont argue about it - have both and move on 

thats a a very good point and should be noted, thing that makes me laugh is the people that dont have trad skills, they will be losing money hand over fist.

Ian

[Kev R]

I you can only clean a window with wfp can you really call yourself a window cleaner?

I think not

[windowwashers]

A person only cleaning wfp is a window washer 

thats not a bad thing 

[Kev R]

A valued commercial customer asks can you clean the internal glass please?

If you have no trad skills you either say no and lose money and face

or sub it out - and lose money and face

or do it and hopefully develop a new skill  ( or get sacked for a bad job)

Personally if I was starting out I would want to learn all aspects of the trade as I have. I charge top dollar now for providing a quality service. I cant remember the last time I turned a commercial job down. Big or small I want it all...LOL 

The is a guy local to me, he has wfp but cant do trad, because he has never bothered to learn how to clean glass properly he is getting a bad name. He used to clean telephone boxes trad but thats it. If a customer asks for trad he says no!!! Madness in my opinion. I offer to show him, but he didn't want to know, there is no helping some people 

[geefree]

i learned the trad way,, and now mostly wfp.. its quicker and i make more money hand over fist.

also i hate cleaning the insides as its slow and faffy... even priced higher i still dont enjoy.

personal choices i guess.

[Sir Squeaky]

I'd rather work wfp as it's easier, but I'd get bored of it if I didn't use my squeegee sometimes too.

I still do nearly all bungalows by hand, and a few downstairs.

Done properly wfp is not massively quicker than a fast trad cleaner (like myself).

I probably turn over 15-20% more per day (closer to 15 usually I'd say).
But the big point is, it's a much easier day.

[geefree]

I'd rather work wfp as it's easier, but I'd get bored of it if I didn't use my squeegee sometimes too.

I still do nearly all bungalows by hand, and a few downstairs.

Done properly wfp is not massively quicker than a fast trad cleaner (like myself).

I probably turn over 15-20% more per day (closer to 15 usually I'd say).
But the big point is, it's a much easier day.

think that sums it all up squeaky.

[groundhog]

I probably turn over 15-20% more per day (closer to 15 usually I'd say).

I'd say more like 50% or more if your any good!!! 

[NWH]

If you include what you used to pay in wages and the amount your now doing it would be far far more than 15-20%,i`m saving more than that in wages i used to pay staff but i`m doing 1/3 more work at least over a week.50% would be more closer to the mark.

[TennetClean]

Yeah 50% is more like it. 

15%? you're doing something majorly wrong.  You should be at least twice as fast with WFP

[jonah]

Yeah 50% is more like it. 

15%? you're doing something majorly wrong.  You should be at least twice as fast with WFP

Is that arriving at the job, setting up , doing job and packing up for just one house ?  Or is it quicker when there are several houses close together ?

[windowwashers]

Yeah 50% is more like it. 

15%? you're doing something majorly wrong.  You should be at least twice as fast with WFP

that is only true if you are doing big houses or easy access that is a fact.

I challenge you to try and beat me on a bunglow with wfp against me trad, I know the result.

do it, and we can have a book on here.

Ian
p.s I am wfp and I am quick

[NWH]

I was meaning that it`s quicker in general over the course of the week-month,i`m not on about bungalows lol.

[windowwashers]

I was meaning that it`s quicker in general over the course of the week-month,i`m not on about bungalows lol.

not aimed at you m8 

[NWH]

 

[jonah]

I think wfp has its place to clean high reach windows , but the only downside to it I can see is that you cant check the finnished job !  Once I have cleaned a property I would hate to go back and re clean the windows .  If this problem could be solved I would be really tempted to give it a go  

[Kev R]

Quicker or slower my commercials are wfp outside and trad inside no getting away from that  

Sure wfp is quicker on externals but internally its the same.  

If you do domestics wfp is defo quicker and safer but if you do large commercial you have to do both.

So ones not better than the other, there just window cleaners tools  

[NWH]

I know what your saying mate but it does a good enough job for me,i know a WC round where i work and he is picky to say the least,he`s more interested in doing an immaculate job than earning a living.There comes a point where you have to be sensible about it,if the phones not ringing your doing something right.

[NWH]

The art to it i find is to mix the 2 trad and WFP,if trad is quicker i`ll trad and vice versa.

[Kev R]

I think wfp has its place to clean high reach windows , but the only downside to it I can see is that you cant check the finnished job !  Once I have cleaned a property I would hate to go back and re clean the windows .  If this problem could be solved I would be really tempted to give it a go  

But once you have learned to use wfp properly you will never get called back!

Is your eyesight that bad that you cant see an upper window?

[jonah]

I think wfp has its place to clean high reach windows , but the only downside to it I can see is that you cant check the finnished job !  Once I have cleaned a property I would hate to go back and re clean the windows .  If this problem could be solved I would be really tempted to give it a go  

But once you have learned to use wfp properly you will never get called back!

Is your eyesight that bad that you cant see an upstairs window?

sorry thought you left the window wet ...............my mistake !

[Kev R]

you do leave it wet but you will see any particles etc when you rinse so as long as you rinse well you can be assured the window will dry to an equivalent result as trad 

[mark dew]

I think wfp has its place to clean high reach windows , but the only downside to it I can see is that you cant check the finnished job !  Once I have cleaned a property I would hate to go back and re clean the windows .  If this problem could be solved I would be really tempted to give it a go  

With wfp all you have to do is check the job once after the windows are dry. Once a job comes up good it will almost always come up good after that.

you do leave it wet but you will see any particles etc when you rinse so as long as you rinse well you can be assured the window will dry to an equivalent result as trad

I think so too.
It is quite eay to see how they are when rinsing, especially if the windows sheet as the water seems to hit a bump if there is some dirt still on the window.

[jonah]

Ok imagine I was your employee , and it was my first day .   I am nervous and know nothing about cleaning windows ( Yes true so far i hear you say )  explain to me how to clean the first upstairs window .    

[mark dew]

Sorry jonah, can't be bothered to explain. Too many variables depending on the type of window. I would simply tell you to watch me and avoid the vents. And i would check them when they are dry.
I wouldn't expect perfection each time, but unless there's fly poo i would feel confident about the job.
I would also make a point of telling the customer we are only a phone call away if they notice any problems.

[windowwashers]

Ok imagine I was your employee , and it was my first day .   I am nervous and know nothing about cleaning windows ( Yes true so far i hear you say )  explain to me how to clean the first upstairs window .    

clean top first, them clean frames, then go bacl to the top and do it again, rinse frames the rinse top on frames again (first cleans), clean window, the rishnse top to bottom easy.

Ian

[geefree]

Yeah 50% is more like it. 

15%? you're doing something majorly wrong.  You should be at least twice as fast with WFP

that is only true if you are doing big houses or easy access that is a fact.

I challenge you to try and beat me on a bunglow with wfp against me trad, I know the result.

do it, and we can have a book on here.

Ian
p.s I am wfp and I am quick

is that including getting all the dirt off the frames....

[windowwashers]

Yeah 50% is more like it. 

15%? you're doing something majorly wrong.  You should be at least twice as fast with WFP

that is only true if you are doing big houses or easy access that is a fact.

I challenge you to try and beat me on a bunglow with wfp against me trad, I know the result.

do it, and we can have a book on here.

Ian
p.s I am wfp and I am quick

is that including getting all the dirt off the frames....

no, after first cleans 

[geefree]

 

[L.J.Thorpe]

Does it really matter? Trad is best, theres no doubt about that IF its done properly. I still prefer it. But I use WFP because its quicker and easier.

Most of the customers are fine with it. About 10% don't take to it but they get dropped. Plenty more fish in the sea.

I run a business, the purpose of that business is to make money for me and my family.

Friday afternoons I pay all the money into the bank. its the figure at the bottom of the paying in slip that is important, Nothing else. 

this says it all really
sorry jonah but this is balls mate
trad  does give a better finish to the trained eye,but how many of your customers are window cleaners?
for volume of work at a standard acceptable to 95% of customers the pole is far and away the best and safest way
i KNOW that i can go back to most windows i have done and find a small fault if i look hard enough,but some customers would pay up if they find a ticket through the letterbox  and not even check the work

[jonah]

Does it really matter? Trad is best, theres no doubt about that IF its done properly. I still prefer it. But I use WFP because its quicker and easier.

Most of the customers are fine with it. About 10% don't take to it but they get dropped. Plenty more fish in the sea.

I run a business, the purpose of that business is to make money for me and my family.

Friday afternoons I pay all the money into the bank. its the figure at the bottom of the paying in slip that is important, Nothing else. 

this says it all really
sorry jonah but this is balls mate
trad  does give a better finish to the trained eye,but how many of your customers are window cleaners?
for volume of work at a standard acceptable to 95% of customers the pole is far and away the best and safest way
i KNOW that i can go back to most windows i have done and find a small fault if i look hard enough,but some customers would pay up if they find a ticket through the letterbox  and not even check the work

Oh mr thorpe you need a break from this site lol

[Wayne Thomas]

I know what your saying mate but it does a good enough job for me,i know a WC round where i work and he is picky to say the least,he`s more interested in doing an immaculate job than earning a living.There comes a point where you have to be sensible about it,if the phones not ringing your doing something right.

I use to be too particular about doing an over the top job when I was trad so that no one could fault me. Then I switched to WFP because of health reasons and was determined I wasn't going to fall into that trap of being too fussy with regards very high standards of work. So long as the job is good with the minimum of time, that's it, no more timewasting trying to be the best. Time is money as the saying goes and so be it.

[windowwashers]

Does it really matter? Trad is best, theres no doubt about that IF its done properly. I still prefer it. But I use WFP because its quicker and easier.

Most of the customers are fine with it. About 10% don't take to it but they get dropped. Plenty more fish in the sea.

I run a business, the purpose of that business is to make money for me and my family.

Friday afternoons I pay all the money into the bank. its the figure at the bottom of the paying in slip that is important, Nothing else. 

this says it all really
sorry jonah but this is balls mate
trad  does give a better finish to the trained eye,but how many of your customers are window cleaners?
for volume of work at a standard acceptable to 95% of customers the pole is far and away the best and safest way
i KNOW that i can go back to most windows i have done and find a small fault if i look hard enough,but some customers would pay up if they find a ticket through the letterbox  and not even check the work

new customer today, asked me to do there windows I was doing next door, only wanted up, said they was over the moon with the finish, guy comes up to me after ND SHANKES MY HAND "WELL DONE SON " thank you I say, he said I was a window cleaner for 30 years you do a very good job........ I was well happy with that comment, I try my best but when an old pro says it makes it feel so so much better 

[geefree]

Jonah, you are reading all the posts , regarding ro-systems, tanks, pumps, parts and everything else you need for wfp.... and looking at it in a negative light, and its putting you off,

you have been on this forum long enough to have read all the benefits wfp brings..

believe me , you will and have more to worry about than your microfibres in later life ... or even now... using ladders..

yes you do need all THAT gear to use wfp system,... but once you have it your life will be far easier... now and in years to come.

jonah you would love it.

and you are safe.

you remind me of a fella on here who would never ever convert to wfp... but he has now, and i know he is a happier man.

[jonah]

Jonah, you are reading all the posts , regarding ro-systems, tanks, pumps, parts and everything else you need for wfp.... and looking at it in a negative light, and its putting you off,

you have been on this forum long enough to have read all the benefits wfp brings..

believe me , you will and have more to worry about than your microfibres in later life ... or even now... using ladders..

yes you do need all THAT gear to use wfp system,... but once you have it your life will be far easier... now and in years to come.

jonah you would love it.

and you are safe.

you remind me of a fella on here who would never ever convert to wfp... but he has now, and i know he is a happier man.

Bet he is a fatty !

[geefree]

dont know about that,, but if you are saying trad keeps you fit and the pole doesnt, then you are wrong... hands, shoulders arms.. all those parts are getting exercised... and we all still go quick and rush.... good for the lungs...

and my arms now look like i go to the gymm.
 

[Sir Squeaky]

I probably turn over 15-20% more per day (closer to 15 usually I'd say).

I'd say more like 50% or more if your any good!!! 

If you're crap at trad, yes.

[geefree]

i got pretty fast at trad... i raced other cleaners lol...
they did not know.

but i now clean 40% quicker in day. wfp

upstairs window. clean it. pop brush on next window clean it. ... and so on.

how can that not be quicker .? by 50%

of course it is..

even if you take into account everything involved too, before you start saying hoses , reels. bla bla bla.

dont understand how anyone can say its not quicker than trad.

in my opinion, to me its the people who are stuck. steadfast in the past, set in their ways... wont move with the times, and wont accept change who say trad is the best...of course it isnt....

is a screwdriver quicker than a cordless powered one?..... to people who dont accept change , or move on, yes it is...

but in the real world , the modern world.  technology is changing how we live and work..... and one day the debate regarding wfp and trad will not exist....

apart from an odd old timer who insists the old days were the best.

granted ..trad insides is the only way....

buts thats the only time it will be used... in the future...

and, i will bet one day that will be replaced.

accept things. the future is bright.

[mark dew]

The fine thing about trad is that you actually leave the job as a finished article. There are no doubts, ifs or buts. You turn up to dry, dirty windows and you leave dry, clean windows.
The wet windows and puddles on the ground are really the main reason customers are unsure of wfp. That is understandable of course.
But what about that ionics setup shown in their magazine last month which had a vacuum thing that allowed wfp to be used indoors by sucking the water up and was recycled?
I think that has the greatest potential in future.
Imagine using wfp and leaving the windows and ground dry. It's brilliant.
Also with recycling the water it would be possible to take maybe 50 or 100 litres out and work all day doing the same amount of jobs as a 500 litre or 1000 litre tank will allow now.
Fair play to ionics. A zero waste RO and recycling the water used at work would allow all wfp cleaners to work whether there was a drought order or not.
An affordable hot water system with zero waste and powerful vacuum to suck up the water used when working would be a dream come true. A bit like finding the holy grail for window cleaners.
I really look forward to reading on here about the 1st person to successfully diy this setup.

[windowwashers]

i got pretty fast at trad... i raced other cleaners lol...
they did not know.

but i now clean 40% quicker in day. wfp

upstairs window. clean it. pop brush on next window clean it. ... and so on.

how can that not be quicker .? by 50%

of course it is..

even if you take into account everything involved too, before you start saying hoses , reels. bla bla bla.

dont understand how anyone can say its not quicker than trad.

in my opinion, to me its the people who are stuck. steadfast in the past, set in their ways... wont move with the times, and wont accept change who say trad is the best...of course it isnt....

is a screwdriver quicker than a cordless powered one?..... to people who dont accept change , or move on, yes it is...

but in the real world , the modern world.  technology is changing how we live and work..... and one day the debate regarding wfp and trad will not exist....

apart from an odd old timer who insists the old days were the best.

granted ..trad insides is the only way....

buts thats the only time it will be used... in the future...

and, i will bet one day that will be replaced.

accept things. the future is bright.

Have to stick up fopr sqeaky here, there is no way you can be 50% QUICKER AT WFP to trad unless you was very slow at trad and I was quick, I think squeaky is nearly bank on the money with 15/20%

I watch time I alweays have done and I am quick trad wfp I may not be I dont know not seen anyone else doing it in my area apart from the guy that stabed me in the back before I did it   love memory.

anyway trad is quicker on somethings thats a fact wfp on alot of thing is quick 50% IMHO is way out unless as said you either are slow at trad or cany do it.


Ian

p.s if you think I am wrong please let me come out for the day and prove me wrong

[windowwashers]

The fine thing about trad is that you actually leave the job as a finished article. There are no doubts, ifs or buts. You turn up to dry, dirty windows and you leave dry, clean windows.
The wet windows and puddles on the ground are really the main reason customers are unsure of wfp. That is understandable of course.
But what about that ionics setup shown in their magazine last month which had a vacuum thing that allowed wfp to be used indoors by sucking the water up and was recycled?
I think that has the greatest potential in future.
Imagine using wfp and leaving the windows and ground dry. It's brilliant.
Also with recycling the water it would be possible to take maybe 50 or 100 litres out and work all day doing the same amount of jobs as a 500 litre or 1000 litre tank will allow now.
Fair play to ionics. A zero waste RO and recycling the water used at work would allow all wfp cleaners to work whether there was a drought order or not.
An affordable hot water system with zero waste and powerful vacuum to suck up the water used when working would be a dream come true. A bit like finding the holy grail for window cleaners.
I really look forward to reading on here about the 1st person to successfully diy this setup.

I saw the Ionics system first hand and aprt for being three times at leasst slower, it leaves lines same as a squeege on a pole does there idea is a good one to me it is a rushed job to be the first without the home work, fair play to them and diy I would love to see it, only takes one person to pay over 10k for the system and think this aint that hard to do and post it on here then diy indoor will be launched IMo.

Did open up my mind to what can be done

[mark dew]

I saw the Ionics system first hand and aprt for being three times at leasst slower, it leaves lines same as a squeege on a pole

I didn't know that.
But it's early days still and i'm sure these drawbacks could be rectified. I think ionics have done the hardest part by showing us that it is actually possible. Something i thought was a contradiction until i saw the article.

[TennetClean]

there is no way you can be 50% QUICKER AT WFP to trad unless you was very slow at trad and I was quick, I think squeaky is nearly bank on the money with 15/20%

Quite possibly the most clueless post yet.  Just because what you have personally experienced has not been that much quicker, it does not mean that is wrong.

Also, saying "thats a fact" after everything you've said doesnt make you right.  No offense matey, but you have to accept that sometimes you're own experience is different from others, and their points are just as valid as yours.

What was it my grandpa used to say...

"Hire a teenager while they still know everything"

[geefree]

there is no way you can be 50% QUICKER AT WFP to trad unless you was very slow at trad and I was quick, I think squeaky is nearly bank on the money with 15/20%

Quite possibly the most clueless post yet. Just because what you have personally experienced has not been that much quicker, it does not mean that is wrong.

Also, saying "thats a fact" after everything you've said doesnt make you right. No offense matey, but you have to accept that sometimes you're own experience is different from others, and their points are just as valid as yours.

What was it my grandpa used to say...

"Hire a teenager while they still know everything"

bang on.. i am fairly quick trad... 50% quicker wfp... fact lol

[xxmattyxx]

One point worth making, that I think has been omitted so far, is that with WFP you can work for longer in any given day compared to ladder work, well I can anyway. Which is why I have more energy now.

Which is why Im up at 6.30 on a Saturday morning.

[Londoner]

One point worth making, that I think has been omitted so far, is that with WFP you can work for longer in any given day compared to ladder work, well I can anyway. Which is why I have more energy now.

Which is why Im up at 6.30 on a Saturday morning.

Very good point.

[groundhog]

I probably turn over 15-20% more per day (closer to 15 usually I'd say).

I'd say more like 50% or more if your any good!!! 

If you're crap at trad, yes.

More like if your crap at wfp then you will be only 15-20% quicker, if you know what your doing then you will be at least 50% quicker!!! I have many jobs that I am now doing 3 times as quick with wfp compared to when I used to clean them trad!! And I was pretty quick at trad too! 

[windowwashers]

there is no way you can be 50% QUICKER AT WFP to trad unless you was very slow at trad and I was quick, I think squeaky is nearly bank on the money with 15/20%

Quite possibly the most clueless post yet.  Just because what you have personally experienced has not been that much quicker, it does not mean that is wrong.

Also, saying "thats a fact" after everything you've said doesnt make you right.  No offense matey, but you have to accept that sometimes you're own experience is different from others, and their points are just as valid as yours.

What was it my grandpa used to say...

"Hire a teenager while they still know everything"

No offense taken, but just to clear it up I said it was a fact that trad can be quicker on some jobs, which is true, I know others work faster some slower, but wfp Imo can be slower sometimes.
I know wfp is faster on alot of things.

Ian

I learn everyday, and wish I was a teenager

[Sir Squeaky]

More like if your crap at wfp then you will be only 15-20% quicker, if you know what your doing then you will be at least 50% quicker!!! I have many jobs that I am now doing 3 times as quick with wfp compared to when I used to clean them trad!! And I was pretty quick at trad too! 

On a 3 storey office with multiple panes you will be 50% quicker, maybe 3 times like you say.
But that's not typical work.

I can do an average 3 bed house in 10-14 mins trad.
So you can do it about 5 mins wfp?
I'd like to see the results.

[Kev R]

The fine thing about trad is that you actually leave the job as a finished article. There are no doubts, ifs or buts. You turn up to dry, dirty windows and you leave dry, clean windows.
The wet windows and puddles on the ground are really the main reason customers are unsure of wfp.

Customers love it - its safer - the frames get done to - your always on time as it can be done in the rain - as to puddles on the floor how much water do you think a skilled wfp user uses?

Just keep finding excuses not to switch and you'll be the one left behind - its that simple!

[Kev R]

Speed - I have a large commercial job we used to do  trad on the outside. It took 6 men all day (8 hours) - now it takes three men 6 hours

And were not talking amateur window cleaners here either.

Labour cost are the biggest expense of any service business - You half your staff or take on more work - either way wfp pays

seriously guys - get with the program 

[pjulk]

I must be doing something wrong if people are getting 50% quicker.
You can on leaded but on run of the mill house as other have said im about 20% quicker some are no differant in time.

But hey im not a teenager anymore so i don't rush around like a looney like i did when i was younger.

[jonah]

Some very good posts