[Moderator David@stives]

Do you think we should keep talking about money on this site.

For me i dont think it is a good idea to keep talking money.

I think we all know what the potential income could be given the right circumstances.

The reason i think we should put a lid on it. Is because people reading this site must think that window cleaning is a gold mine and some people will get a shock when they first start up.

These last 2 months there has been countless new members coming on here and wanting to start up.
I have never seen so many.

I dont know of any other trade where they give up all there secrets and tell the world how much they can earn.

Before we know it we will ruin it for ourselves.

In my area there are more and more people starting up.and the phone does not ring like it used to.

My business is still growing because i am using my head and my experience to keep ahead of the field.

What do you think

[busydaffodil]

David, you know I am not in the window cleaning industry (previously a commercial cleaner) but I so agree with you about not stating takings on a forum like this.   My reasons for this also is that
1.   I think it is unfair on joe public to dazzle them with big money.  We could be helping them line themselves up for failure.  Self Employment isnt suited to everyone.     
2.   Who knows whos monitoring these websites?  Even local competition could do some serious damage with info obtained off here.  (Am I paranoid?)
3.   I always work on the theory that the less people know, the less they can hurt you.     

Many of my customers say my business must earn a packet & I often get the "So how much do places like this take per day then?" question.
My reply is   "I could tell you, but then I'd have to kill you"    OR    "Jeez, not even my husband know that info!!"    Not even my staff know exactly, & some of them have been with me for years.   
in any other industry I have worked, these has not been the openess about takings as seen on these types of forums.

Perhaps theres some sort of "My business is better than yours cos look at what I take"  game going on??

[D woods]

Hi David

This is a very good point the only problem is most window cleaners have
a very strong urge to tell the world how well they are doing (could just be
a London thing)

[H h20]

I have never mentioned earnings on here for many reasons, ie local competition not that `iv`e got any who are on here but you never know, and theres another main reason!,
so im not guilty,Gaz 

[Moderator David@stives]

I was guilty of telling everyone how much i could earn and have slowly come to realise the more you tell the more competition you are setting up for yourself.

From know on my mouth will stay shut.

[busydaffodil]

, and theres another main reason!,

Which is what?  You like secrets dont you!!

[H h20]

, and theres another main reason!,

Which is what?  You like secrets dont you!!

There are some secrets that WILL stay secrets ,Gaz 

[busydaffodil]

oh yes!   lol    Forgot   

I'm guessing the other reason is Inland Rev forum snoops? 

[steve k]

I think there is a tendency to want to show people that our profession is a viable form of employment these days and shove their condescending attitude towards the steroetypical image of window cleaners down their throats. Hence the urge to almost be saying:
" hang on...do you know what I am earning??"

I do not believe any of our customers would get out of bed to access a forum like this to obtain information about earning potential.
Even if they did, there is such an enormous divide in earnings from one cleaner to another never mind county to county. No-one could nail down precise earnings of an individual.

Competitors in the commercial sector may very well use information gained on here to submit a lower price, but in the domestic world, someone would have to not only want to work in your precise area, they would have to follow you and get the addresses of where you work and then they have the obstacle of the customer being happy with you and not being prepared to offload you for a £1.00 coin.
I can honestly say that I would find it difficult to think of more than 5 customers who may do that after our window cleaning Serpico has done several months of stalking and detective work and offered my customers a cheaper clean.

It is also very unusual for anyone to hit a rich seam of customers from day one. So, any fears of Joe Bloggs reading this and throwing away his job in the office on the say so of a few unknown window cleaners are, in my opinion, completely without foundation.
There may be the odd one of course and if he does jump on the bandwagon, he will very shortly be introduced to reality.
At this point, he will say:
"they bl**dy well deserve it...I`m off !"
or he may say:
"I`ve got a chance of success here...I`ll stick with it and go for it !"

In either case, good luck to them...we have all been there.

If the Inland revenue want to question my tax return, they are free to do so...they are also free to waste thousands of pounds of public money following me round every customer and asking every customer to make a statement about when I clean and how much I charge.
In all honesty, do you really think they are going to do that?

If they did, they would find nothing they do not know anyway but would also incur the wrath of many letter writers to the local press about the terrible waste of money the investigation has cost.

In short, what you have built is something to be proud of...it took time, effort and perseverance.

If you are above board in all your accounting, fear nothing.

If you are commercial...keep schtum!!

If you are domestic...be proud and if you want to, sing your salary out to the masses...

they probably aren`t listening

[Jeff Brimble]

Off topic, Steve , know anything about the original Serpico Film aprox1978 ?

[supernova77]

I have a theory as to why there are so many new window cleaning startups at the moment:

People have an extended break from work over the Christmas \ New Year period and then go back to work... After a few days start thinking about being there own boss, having more time etc... so start thinking about starting up as a window cleaner.

[steve k]

Jeff, read the book...fantastic and as usual, much better than the film

Southern, maybe after a summer holiday, but I do not think many people in a warm office in January look out at the rain and sleet and say
"I know...i`ll get out there and clean windows"

[matt]

i hate to say it

its whe worse kept secret around that WC'er can earn good money

Ive had 7 leaflets through my door since start of Nov 

every1 i speak to mentions the "new system" and how much it can earn you

[steve k]

Matt,
your window cleaner must be happy then...

[supernova77]

Well - A couple of winters ago I sat in a warm office earning £30 per hour (I was in IT) and thought to myself "there must be something I can do that would earn me a decent wage, and let me be my own boss, give me more time etc"... And here I am today running my own successful window cleaning company... I would NEVER go back to working in an office again!

[steve k]

yes...so was I...but it certainly wasn`t winter when I decided

[DASERVICES]

  Was speaking to a mate in Telford Shropshire and he informed me that two people in his street have been made redundant and wit their money have gone and purchased WFP'S and new vans.

Sooner or later there will be a glut of WFP'ers and soon the price war might begin as with WFP window cleaning now is a easy option.

[P @ F]

Do you really think its going to get that bad , with the ammount of wcs going up that much , and will price wars really start ?
Its just that i want to branch into commercial very soon , that i think is where the price wars will be , it scares me a bit  .

 Rich   P @ F

[H h20]

I have`nt noticed any increase around here infact it`s gone down,iv`e been window cleaning for 18 years and seen them come and go,like most they think it`s an easy option and before long they can`t take it and disapear and leave us REAL window cleaners to mop up their left overs and iv`e been able to charge more ,and as far as going straight into wfp not everyone has the facility to be able to do it my brother has been window cleaning for about 12 years and has said he can never see him self going to wfp because he hasn`t got the room at home hes got 4 kids and his house is cramped as it is and has to park his car away from his house,i`m not worried at all every day when i go to work and people see me with my wfp they think the aliens have landed and theres only a couple of others with wfp and i very rarely see them,Gaz

[simbo]

yea gaz,
a lot start up and think hey this is great, but then get fed up chasing money every night or no work due to bad weather. There will be a lot more though now because they do not have to climb ladders, but unlesss you can work intelegently they will struggle just the sameb besides there is plenty of crap work around, as hopefully we will have all the good doing a professional job
cheers simb0
ps just to note i will be the first in my area to get wfp and i know at least 15 cleaners

[macc]

they start up cause they think its easy and easy money. it still takes commitment in all weather, thats what my customers get. as 4 letting on what we earn, i dont think we should shout too loud cause its our buisness. as 4 the inland revenue, i wouldnt put it past them, i was supposed 2 have an opp this week, bennifits, joke, £30 approx, how can i live on that. they told me i should have saved. 

[Sarah Sarill]

My moto has always been not to discuss our financial situation with anyone - its personal 

Sarah

[macc]

spot on sarah

[Morph]

My moto has always been not to discuss our financial situation with anyone - its personal

Sarah

I have learned in life that, those who are open about their finances usually haven't got much.
Those who don't discuss it, usually have plenty.

A guy from Gambia was quite happy to discuss with me his currency and the fact that he earns £50 a month, but he doesn't discuss it locally because others would be jealous.

I live near the Docks.  A cargo vessel captain was telling me that that they don't bother employing English "deck hands", because they don't work for less than £200 a week, they can get eastern europeans and phillipinos to work for £50 a week 12 hour days!

Sorry, off topic.

It's all relative.  You can only wear one pair of shoes at a time.  If you are fortunate enough to have two feet.

Pj

By the way, look back through my posts, I don't discuss my finances
In fact every now and then I delete all my garbage, and change my name

[windows_chepstow]

It interests me to hear what people can earn to a point, though I rarely post what I earn; cos you lot would take the micky.

I have been narked in the past by people showing off.  They post something like, "Yeh, really windy and rainy today.  Only worked two hours and earn't six-squillion-quid anyway."

That bugs me.

However, I've went down the WFP route, encouraged by what others have said they can earn using it.

[twt]

if you earn enought to cover your bills and have some left over you are more fortunate than alot of people out there who have to worry about every penny.

[stuart webster]

It's not what you earn that is important, but what you spend.

What's the point of earning £2000 per week spending it all and missing seeing your family grow up?

I'd rather earn less, spend less but see my family more.

The Bear

[busydaffodil]

It's not what you earn that is important, but what you spend.

What's the point of earning £2000 per week spending it all and missing seeing your family grow up?

I'd rather earn less, spend less but see my family more.

The Bear

Well Said!

[Ian_Giles]

I have often made mention (well, ok, not that often ) of the money I earn, not to show off though, more to point out that though you may be able to knock out £300 in a single day Very, very few of us will manage that, still fewer will manage it day in, day out, just won't happen for the majority.

You CAN earn a decent living, but it takes hard work, day in and day out you have to work bloody hard to earn good money.

I think perhaps that us window cleaners are often stung into showing the kind of income we CAN earn.
People still have the cloth cap and ladder under your arm image of a window cleaner.
How often do people come up to you and sing "When I'm cleaning windows!"
Or ask if you are related to George Foremby (er, spelling )

We should instead stay quietly smug as we go about our work, that car salesman in the smart showroom may feel he's the dogs bollux, but he is probably earning far less than you per hour.

But it is the arrogance of others that makes us feel stung to show that we too can earn a good living  

Perhaps we shouldn't do it, as has been stated elswhere on here, across t he board the average income for a window cleaner is £17,500 per year.
A great many will be below that and a fair few above that.

But that is the kind of general figure that most of us might aspire to hover around.

As for those that splash out deveral grand on a van and WFP without any real prior experience?
Some will regret it bitterly when they find that they have to actually work bloody hard to earn their money.
And they will still need to learn all of the trad skills too, and that'll take them a bloody long time to master if they are not doing it every day all day.

All that glitters is not gold!!

Ian

[thewindowcleaner1]

The Job is not too bad but then when you consider what else is involved with windowcleaning

Customer relations
Marketing
Cash Flow projections
Book Keeping
round administration
     and thats before you even clean a window
Quality controle
equipment maintanance
Equipment purchase
Priceing..

  I was stopped by fella that had been watching me clean a few of his neighbours windows (about 5 years ago) he started the conversation with "you must be earing some good money" he'd watched me clean about 4 houses @ £5 in less than an hour. I smiled and carried on,
   What he hadn't seen was the time that it had taken me to get four customers close to each other, the time taken to return and collect,the time to keep the round in order and keep the books up to date, and most importantly the time it had taken me to learn the job well enough so that I could do 4 houses in less than an hour..

      I think about this time every year lots of new WC's start up but not many stay the course, Harder than they thought,Too Cold, Too Hot, Too Wet, Too Windy, Looks like rain,

   I think One of the most important qualitys needed is Self Motivation, and not many people have that.

  Having said all that YES I'm seeing more than normal new Wc's around, which has made think very carefully about putting ALL my prices up, and YES I do think that this new fangled WFP system will bring new people into the trade, but on the plus side some of the systems that I,ve seen around are little better than bargan basement and take the opperater longer to clean the windows than the Trad way.

A little copetition is good for the system keeps you on your toes and should help you improve your service so that the copetition becomes little more than small itch...

thats me gone trying to replace my pertol bombed van,(hope it wasn't the copetition that did it???)

Alan