[Fox]

Hi Guys

Bit of a dilemma here!  One of my employees asked a little while ago for 6 weeks holiday - of course he was told no he couldn't take that long in one period of leave.

It has now come to my attention that he has been speaking with another employee about sick pay and industrial injury.  He has said that he feels he should be entitled to full sick pay and not just SSP if he goes sick (he has worked for 6mnths and not been off sick to date, he is also full time) and asked if he had an 'accident' at work then how much would he get and that surely if it was at work he would have to get full pay etc.  I suspect he is still going to take the 6 weeks he wants, just on the sick and try to get as much money out of me as poss in the process.  On the other hand I could be wrong and these could just be innocent questions on his employment rights.

Right my dilemma is - do I dismiss this employee (I'm not looking for answers on whether I can or not, just do you think I should) - or do I just pull him into the offfice and ask why he is asking these questions and let him know that I know what he is (or might be) up too.

So what would you do?
Fox

[allergease]

Not an easy one Fox as you only have the word of the other employee that he has been asking about sick pay. As you don't want advice regarding employment law (not that I can give you any) only should you dismiss him or challenge him regarding the questions he's been asking, can I ask is he otherwise a good, trustworthy employee ? How much would it cost you in advertising and training to replace him if you dismissed him ? Would you need to replace him if he genuinely had an accident at work and had a prolonged period of time off sick or would you manage to cope without him for a period of time ?

If he genuinely trustworthy and an asset to your business would you consider allowing him to have six weeks leave (some of which might well be unpaid) and spread his work round other staff members. That way you win as you don't need to spend money recruiting and training. He wins as he gets his six weeks leave and hopefully feels obliged to go the extra mile to keep you satisfied in the future.

Conrad

[Prestige1]

Is he Polish? just kidding.
If I was you I would record and diary everything, dates etc what he has said, get a statement of your other employer what he has said, and then get him in the office with another witness and just tell him you have concerns as to some of the questions he has been asking, come across like a concerned employee and ask is everything ok, and record everthing afterwoods. he will then find it extreamily hard to justify long term sick or injury. if its your policy that you don't pay full sick pay then thats it he is just entitled to ssp. if he is the type to be asking all this you will have to be rock solid as to why you sack him.
hope this helps kind regards Phil

[martin19842]

hi there,

they can only self cert themselves for a week i think, so he will need a doctors note, unless they go for stress, or back pain, then the doc will want some evidence.

if your emp contract says that get ssp only then no issues, they took the job on that condition

regards

martin

[Fox]

Thanks guys that's given me some food for thought. 

Just to give you a bit more background.  This guy has been reliable and trustworthy and I have been happy with his performance up until recently.  His timekeeping is not what it should be and I have had to have a word about this on a couple of occasions.  He works on several different sites for me and cleans most of them to a pretty high standard, however there is one site (which is exactly the same lay out as another one he keeps spotless) that is not up to standard and my supervisor tells me when she pulls him up on things he gets really defensive.

He took a week off recently to go to Germany (that's where his last employment was) and then told me it wasn't a holiday but because he had to attend court because he was 'suing' his last employer over pay!  He wouldn't go into any other detail.  So you can see why I am worried that he may turn out to be the type of person who would use anything to get money out of a situation, especially when he starts asking wierd questions.

I am in a quandry because I don't want to dismiss someone unnecessarily, especially when I know he needs the job, but I need to protect my interests.  As for covering his work I have people who would take some of his work and I don't usually advertise for staff they normally come to me through recommendation so there wouldn't be costs there.  I need to assess the risk to the business because if needed I would rather do the work myself than let someone rip me off (did I just say do it myself!  ).

I am going to go onto his site tonight and ask the person he spoke too to make a statement, at least I'll have that while I am deciding what to do. 

Thanks for taking the time to answer guys and keep any other views coming.

Fox

[garyj]

I would try to protect myself from this by writing down everything you know and posting 2 copies by special delivery, one to him and one to yourself. Leave yours unopened and tell him what you have done in the letter. This unopened letter can then be opened at a tribunal if it goes that far. This idea isn't fool proof but I would think it will make him think twice before he tries anything on.

He will probably leave very shortly afterwards anyway and he'll think your a monster, but you do have to protect yourself from anyone who is going to try and either sue you for a non-existent injury or a false sick claim.
Best of luck, sounds like you'll be well rid of him anyway.

[garyj]

I see you posted slightly before I did. I wouldn't even ask for a statement tonight, in fact I'd stay out the way!! Detail EVERYTHING you can think of, and send it to him ASAP.

[CMS]

I presume that you gave him his 'Statement of Terms and Conditions of Employment' as you were obliged to do within 13 weeks of him starting his employment???

This should have outlined his rights to sick pay, holiday etc.

Where's the problem?

[Fox]

CMS

Yes he has had his terms and conditions and yes this states his rights.  However the dilemma is not sick pay or SSP in general it's the fact of this guy possibly faking it or setting himself up for an accident at work then trying to claim against me. 

Fox

[JJdomestics]

Hi

Just a thought, check and make sure your H & S is all up to date. Where there is blame there is a claim!.  If you think he is devious enought to fake it for sick pay whos to say he wouldn't go one step further

[preston powerblast]

With only having one or two employees and being a new business I just lay them off.
Its a bit of a dilema to be in.

[Paul Forster]

Asking him directly is likely to cause problems, however I would think about giving a warning with regards to the time keeping quality isues, That way if needs be you can have grounds to fire him if the problems continue.

 six months employment is a very short time to be thinking taking a full six weeks off IMHO

Paul

[Jan K]

Hi Fox!

Could you not give his shifts to any of your other existing staff and lay him off stating cut backs as the reason? If his time keeping isn't up to scratch and his work is slipping you could be at risk of losing the Clients he is working for, couldn't you?

Jan