[stuart_clark]

Paul
I used to use rotabrite heated up with Energiser in it, but lately ive been using Dynamal and getting good results! Havn't heard of the others! where do you get them from ?

[Paul Moss]

Buy them here

http://www.cleaningsystems.co.uk/section/151/1/encap_carpet_cleaners

[james roffey]

I like the encap products but the dilution rates make it really expensive stuff to use compared to say Pureclean or SPM

[Paul Moss]

Environ has a good ratio

[Jamie Pearson]

Pureclean and SPM are good products for removing soil from the fibres. You then have to get that soil out of the carpet.

This requires multiple bonnets at a cost of £20+ each or the wringing and cleaning of them as you go.
I believe you need to have dry bonnets to get good "extraction" from the carpet and we would used to take 50+ of the green striped versions to site and change them every 2 litres of product. Then have 2 washing machines running all day to clean them for the next shift.

With an Encap product you only need 1 agitation pad/bonnet (whichever suits the task).
The result of this is ultimately lower cost due to increased productivity and lower investment which offsets the material cost.

Some products also have protector included which you dont get with SPM & Pureclean.
Not an essential requirement unless you are doing a maintenance contract.

As Paul states Environ works at a dilutions up to 1:128 thats less than 8p per made up litre and you can clean a lot of carpet with using only a litre of made up solution.

[james roffey]

That is an impressive ratio, thanks.

Also some interesting thoughts about methods very helpful, i do very little rotary work and if i am honest still struggling to achieve the results i want with it, so am still in the experimenting stages to find the right combination, the best i have found is Craftex catalyst which was a good result but ridiculously expensive to use. so may try this but as you say if it's less work with these products then than should be used in the equation.

I have a new rotary arriving on Monday i opted for onboard tank as i thought an encap would work best applying as you go, am i right in thinking this ?

[Jamie Pearson]

Are you coming to the TACCA day James? Its easier to show these things than explain them.

A tank is okay but can be difficult to get a good distribution of product using gravity feed.

I used Craftex Catalyst briefly with our Dry Fusion system in an attempt to make it as profitable as the system we were using at that time before we sold it on.

It was slightly cheaper than their Activator with very similar results on a maintenance project.

Fusion Clean from Solutions is also in the same ball park.

[stuart_clark]

James
You should try the Dynamall its realy good stuff although a bit pricey , its Boosted with an Oxy solution and is Brilliant on tea and coffee stains

[james roffey]

Just done some calculations on Environ, the ratio on Amtecs site is 1-32 for heavy soiling even at that rate it works out 32 pence per litre of prespray and less than 10 pence per litre on normal soiling, which is very economical.
How good is this product though ? i assume Fusion clean is an Encap too, i asked if it was on cleantalk and got no response, i have used Fusion clean cant say it blew me away though.

[Jamie Pearson]

It is a bonnet cleaner that contains a copolymer for protection.

[*Hector*]

James.... the thing with fusion clean is that you have to mix it at twice the strength it says on the bottle.

I am testing out environ at the moment and it is working better than fusion clean in my opinion, just mixed at the recommended rates.

[stuart_clark]

I have been using fusion clean for about five years and average about two hundred litres a year but to  get a decent clean you need to mix at about 10 to 1

[Len Gribble]

What’s the best vacuum cleaner for post cleaning presumably you do (as recommend re encap)

Thought Roto Brite II is non-surfactant

[james roffey]

10/1 that's expensive to use in my opinion, If Environ is good as Hector suggests and the strongest dilution for heavy soiling is 1/32 then thats more like it, some of the other encap products on the link in this thread are about the same dilution rate also, releasit is 1/32 i have heard that is very good

[Mike Halliday]

The way I see it is the people who design these chemicals must know that cost will be an important factor to the end user, and the cost is a direct link to the dilution rate.

If they make a chemical which requires a dilution rate of 10-1 then they must have a bloody good reason for it,

I hate to say it but if you get a chemical that requires 10-1 to effectively clean a carpet then there must be a reason for it, they know they will have to compete with the 30-1 dilution chemicals... They would be mad to try and compete unless they had a reason and this must be ...... in their opinion to make a chemical to do the job it requires a strength of 10% concentrate.

I bet dynamall would love to say 30-1 and they could if they wanted, but they have been honest and said to clean a carpet they need 10-1

We have already seen the alternative mentioned where a supplier tries to impress us with a high dilution rate (so tries to kid us its cheap to use) but the end users are telling us it needs to be double what it says on the container

[james roffey]

Really good point Mike i can see the logic.

BUT when i started i used a lot of Prochem chemicals one i used was their acid rinse, i found myself going through a hell of a lot of this because the dilution rate was stupid i told the supplier i used and the Prochem salesman when i met him.
I shopped around and found "final phase" an acid rinse that cost a fraction of the cost of the Prochem stuff an amount that would barely fill an eggcup was enough for a full solution tank on my machine. You may well be right but some very good Encap products may also have good dilution rates, maybe thats why i did not get on too well with Fusion clean it was alright no better no worse than MPower, Pureclean etc. so its interesting to see peoples experiences of all these Encap products.

Ps i know M Power isn't an Encap but it's not bad for bonneting

[Shaun_Ashmore]

Mpower is good for bonneting but I do find that an encapsulation cleaner is better.

Shaun

[*Hector*]

Mpower is good for bonneting but I do find that an encapsulation cleaner is better.

Shaun

I agree Shaun. I have also bonnetted with HD, but I prefer bonnetting with an encap

[mark_roberts]

Anyone every seen or reckon it could be done, to put a pump and spray jets onto a cimex machine.  I like the machine but hate the solution delivery system.

Also I've a job this week a big leak from a roof onto carpet tile 2 months ago.  Would usually extract but would encap method work?

Thanks
Mark

[Jamie Pearson]

Cimex (before Truvox acquired them) used to make exactly that model. It was a Japan exports machine but we had one. I have all the bits to build it from the left over spares they had. Just not got round to it.