[Perfect Windows]

We use our poles in a hoseless setup.

Unfortunately, with the new gooseneck without a hole through, I can't find a sensible way to set up hoseless.

Previously, you could set up the EZsnap connector, pull it tight through the gooseneck and trim to length. Now, with no way through the gooseneck, I can't find a sensible way to fix the problem. We've bodged one by fitting gooseneck and hose then stretching the hose before fitting the EZsnap piece and allowing it to drag back but it's a real PITA.

Has anyone resolved this?

Cheers,

Vin

[Perfect Windows]

Solution: Cut off the tab at the bottom then run an 8.5mm drill through the thing and you have a gooseneck you can use for hoseless.



Vin

[Smudger]

Nice mod vin

Why are gardiners doing goosenecks without a hole ?

Darran

[Ched]

Nice mod vin

Why are gardiners doing goosenecks without a hole ?

Darran

So the people who use univalves don't keep snapping jets due to not putting something on the hose to stop it pulling on the jets!
I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

[Smudger]

Nice mod vin

Why are gardiners doing goosenecks without a hole ?

Darran

So the people who use univalves don't keep snapping jets due to not putting something on the hose to stop it pulling on the jets!
I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

huh?

[Ched]

Nice mod vin

Why are gardiners doing goosenecks without a hole ?

Darran

So the people who use univalves don't keep snapping jets due to not putting something on the hose to stop it pulling on the jets!
I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

huh?

The new gooseneck has a fixed 8mm tail that the John guest coupler goes between this and the pole hose. Then at the top of the gooseneck there is a built in JG push fit that a short piece of hose goes from to the jets.

There had been complaints that some people using univalves were pulling the hose at the bottom to shut off water and pulling so hard they yank the jets and break them. I believe anyone fitting a univalve is supposed to put a o-clip above the gooseneck to stop the hose pulling too much on the jets.
Problem is that the new gooseneck fixes one issue of people not installing univalves correctly but makes hoseless quite difficult.

Hope that explains.

[Smudger]

sorry I must be missing something - this look perfect for univalve operation with a fixed stem at the base that is solid it would remove the need for a hose stop or o clip above the goose neck surely ?

Darran

[M & C Window Cleaning]

The problem is that Gardiners and Exceed Innovations are two different companies with their own bits of kit, some of which works well together, but not all.
Gardiners new gooseneck has been designed to help Exceed's Univalve users not to break their own (Gardiner's) jets when not fitted correctly or if their hose stop slips, but it hasn't been designed to work with Exceed's tubeless kit. Hence those who like to use both have this problem.
You can go tubeless with Gardiners new gooseneck but you have to do it without Exceed's kit or modify the gooseneck as explained above and which effectively returns it to the original one that allows the hose to go right through it.
I use Gardiner's gooseneck valve which also doesn't work with Exceed's tubeless kit, so I just have a short hosetail at the base of my pole and have my connector outside the pole instead of inside. This does take some getting used to as the connector goes in and out of the pole, but can be done. I've used this method for several years.

[Smudger]

I see

I use tubeless on ova 8 - no need for the exceed kit but you do need a hose stop - I would just use a double ended jg fitting on the gooseneck or pole hose straight onto the stem job done

Darran

[dazmond]

sorry I must be missing something - this look perfect for univalve operation with a fixed stem at the base that is solid it would remove the need for a hose stop or o clip above the goose neck surely ?

Darran

i use an o clip on my pole hose to jets on my brush as i use a univalve but sometimes i need to adjust it as it slides about(probably due to hot water)....this new gooseneck eliminates the problem altogether......

[Alex Gardiner]

I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

Correct 

The previous version angle adapter base part is still available to buy separately.

[tlwcs]

Nice mod vin

Why are gardiners doing goosenecks without a hole ?

Darran

So the people who use univalves don't keep snapping jets due to not putting something on the hose to stop it pulling on the jets!
I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

huh?

The new gooseneck has a fixed 8mm tail that the John guest coupler goes between this and the pole hose. Then at the top of the gooseneck there is a built in JG push fit that a short piece of hose goes from to the jets.

There had been complaints that some people using univalves were pulling the hose at the bottom to shut off water and pulling so hard they yank the jets and break them. I believe anyone fitting a univalve is supposed to put a o-clip above the gooseneck to stop the hose pulling too much on the jets.
Problem is that the new gooseneck fixes one issue of people not installing univalves correctly but makes hoseless quite difficult.

Hope that explains.

Surely that’s not right.
I use a univalve and the hose is secured the brush side of the gooseneck with a clip. If it wasn’t it would out from the ‘T’ connection before breaking the jet capsules

I couldn’t find the old style goosenecks when I ordered this morning.
Tony

[Ched]

Nice mod vin

Why are gardiners doing goosenecks without a hole ?

Darran

So the people who use univalves don't keep snapping jets due to not putting something on the hose to stop it pulling on the jets!
I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

huh?

The new gooseneck has a fixed 8mm tail that the John guest coupler goes between this and the pole hose. Then at the top of the gooseneck there is a built in JG push fit that a short piece of hose goes from to the jets.

There had been complaints that some people using univalves were pulling the hose at the bottom to shut off water and pulling so hard they yank the jets and break them. I believe anyone fitting a univalve is supposed to put a o-clip above the gooseneck to stop the hose pulling too much on the jets.
Problem is that the new gooseneck fixes one issue of people not installing univalves correctly but makes hoseless quite difficult.

Hope that explains.

Surely that’s not right.
I use a univalve and the hose is secured the brush side of the gooseneck with a clip. If it wasn’t it would out from the ‘T’ connection before breaking the jet capsules

I couldn’t find the old style goosenecks when I ordered this morning.
Tony

https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/replacement-gooseneck-base-part.html old style goosenecks

[Lee GLS]

I see

I use tubeless on ova 8 - no need for the exceed kit but you do need a hose stop - I would just use a double ended jg fitting on the gooseneck or pole hose straight onto the stem job done

Darran

What setup do you have for tubeless on your ova 8? I’ve got a HM 22 ova 8 coming and am undecided how to use tubeless like I have done on my SLX.

[robbo333]

sorry I must be missing something - this look perfect for univalve operation with a fixed stem at the base that is solid it would remove the need for a hose stop or o clip above the goose neck surely ?

Darran

i use an o clip on my pole hose to jets on my brush as i use a univalve but sometimes i need to adjust it as it slides about(probably due to hot water)....this new gooseneck eliminates the problem altogether......

Daz, what I did was wrap some Gorilla tape around the pole hose, just after the O clip. So the O clip can't move any further up towards the brush, because the tape prevents it from moving. I think the tape was about 3/4 inch wide.

[Smudger]

Ok - so on the ova 8 the univalve will not fit inside section 1 so when I set them up I thread pole hole through goose neck and dow section one  I then fit the univalve to the pole hole and pull the univalve so it just touches the base of section one - I then put pole hose on the end of the univalve allowing extra length  to trim to length - I now put section 1 and univalve back into the pole
at the top I use hose stop rather than o clip as these don't move then at the base I trim hose so about 1.5 inches protrude out of the base here I put a double ended (straight) JG fitting - then on the reel I have 30 ft of pole connected to the end microbore hose
so if you need to disconnect the pole just do it at the jg connector.

It is slightly limited in that you cant change the goose neck - but streamline do extension pieces for the top half of their standard goosenecks if you need more length

Darran

[Perfect Windows]

I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

Correct 

The previous version angle adapter base part is still available to buy separately.

Hi Alex,

Is that while stocks last or for good?

Thanks,

Vin

[Splash & dash]

Solution: Cut off the tab at the bottom then run an 8.5mm drill through the thing and you have a gooseneck you can use for hoseless.



Vin

Surely drilling it out like that is making the side walls thinner and the likelihood of the goose neck fracturing is very likely as it’s constantly flexing with pressure being applied to the brush ??

[Alex Gardiner]

I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

Correct 

The previous version angle adapter base part is still available to buy separately.

Hi Alex,

Is that while stocks last or for good?

Thanks,

Vin

Hi Vin

We do have a large stock of these - so the stock should last for many years. We also have the tooling all ready to run off extra batches if ever needed.

It will be interesting seeing what is being used for these sort of setups in 4-5 years time and whether these base parts will be needed anymore 

[Perfect Windows]

Hi Vin

We do have a large stock of these - so the stock should last for many years. We also have the tooling all ready to run off extra batches if ever needed.

It will be interesting seeing what is being used for these sort of setups in 4-5 years time and whether these base parts will be needed anymore 

Thanks, Alex.

I don't have a problem with the new design used with a pole hose but I just can't see a way to use it hoseless. You need a length of hose that's pretty much bang on the length of the section and you need it connected at both ends, one of which is now a JG fitting inside the pole so it can't be connected.

Surely drilling it out like that is making the side walls thinner and the likelihood of the goose neck fracturing is very likely as it’s constantly flexing with pressure being applied to the brush ??

I can't see a way to get hoseless working with the new goosenecks. That's the purpose of the original post. I've found a solution but (as mentioned) it's weaker than it should be. I'm open to a better solution if anyone has one.

And no, I'll never go back to a pole hose.

Vin

[Alex Gardiner]

I can't see a way to get hoseless working with the new goosenecks. That's the purpose of the original post. I've found a solution but (as mentioned) it's weaker than it should be. I'm open to a better solution if anyone has one.

And no, I'll never go back to a pole hose.

Vin

Hi Vin

If I wanted to convert one of our current poles with the new angle adapter to a tubeless setup then I would do something like this:

Products:
1.   Rigid 8mm OD tube - https://www.theplasticshop.co.uk/acrylic-tube-extruded-clear-8mm-od-to-25mm-od.html
2.   8mm to 8mm straight connector - https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/push-fit-8mm-to-8mm-straight-connector.html
3.   8mm female push-fit to female screw thread - https://www.grippatank.co.uk/8mm-x-1-4-bsp-female-adaptor
4.   EZ-Snap male plug to ¼” male thread - https://www.wintecs.co.uk/water-fed-pole-window-cleaning/fittings/couplers/male-microbore-coupling-1-4-39-39-male-thread-for-bbv14ff/

Preparation:
1.   Remove the Quick-LoQ Water-Through angle adapter from the pole and fit the 8mm to 8mm straight connector to the base of the adapter
2.   Assemble the EZ-Snap Plug to ¼” thread to the John Guest 8mm push-fit to female ¼” thread with PTFE tape – measure the length of this fitting from the stop line on the JG fitting where the tube will finish inside to the start of the plug shaft – keep this measurement for later, let’s say it is 15mm – this is Measurement A.
3.   On the pole measure from the top edge of the #1 clamp to the bottom of the end cap – let’s say this is 1490mm – this is Measurement B
4.   Then on the angle adapter measure the length from where the wider part will sit on top of clamp #1 to the inner connection line on the 8mm connector. This is measurement C and should be 115mm.
5.   Take Measurement B and deduct Measurement A and Measurement C – then cut a length of the 8mm OD rigid tube to this exact length – if you want the EZ-Snap male plug to be fully recessed inside the end cap of the pole then also deduct another 15mm or so from this length.

Assembly:
1.   Push-fit the length of rigid 8mm OD tube to the 8mm connector on the base of the angle adapter
2.   Remove the end cap from the pole and slide this angle adapter/tube assembly into the pole from the top and fully fit the angle adapter in position.
3.   Take the EZ-Snap assembly and push fit onto the base of the rigid tube – if the #1 section is shorter than the rest of the pole you may want to pack out around the rigid tube to fit the inside of the #1 section – perhaps with insulating tape. The John Guest assembly should fit inside the #2 section – if for any reason it is too tight then it could be sanded off to fit.
4.   Re-fit the end cap and the male EZ-Snap plug will either be just proud of the end cap or just recessed inside it depending on how you wanted this.
5.   Then as long as your hose length has a female EZ-Snap coupling on, it should easily connect and slide up the pole in use.

I have never done the above, but it is the method I would use if approaching this task. It may need a little tweaking in set up depending on your exact use and products being worked with 

[Perfect Windows]

I like the solution - I did consider a solid pipe solution in the past - but I guess we'll be buying the old goosenecks for a little while longer...

Vin

[Perfect Windows]

I see

I use tubeless on ova 8 - no need for the exceed kit but you do need a hose stop - I would just use a double ended jg fitting on the gooseneck or pole hose straight onto the stem job done

Darran

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but I'm currently trying to convert a phantom pole to hoseless and it's a doozy. The smallest tube is around 110mm inside the outer tube when the pole is collapsed. Here's a terrible drawing of the cross section at the bottom of the collapsed pole:



Now I know that the Ova poles have a very short inner section. The question I have is how have you bridged the gap from the  bottom end of the inner tube to the base of the outer tube so you have a male connector you can reach with the female hose connector?

I'm bodging together a set of 3D printed parts and some conduit but I wondered if there is a better solution. I thought your post read like you might have found one. Have you?

Vin

[Smudger]

No I couldn't get anything to work very well

I did this - set the univalve up tight to the end of section 1 - used a short piece of hose just past pole base - - on the hose I used John guest fitting - had trouble getting a rectus fitting to work - lots of self releasing and it was really too tight a fit in the pole
because the univalve does not fit inside section 1 a tubeless doesn't work - I have ground 2 flats on a univalve so it goes inside section 1

I have (for now) abandoned tubeless and returned to a more traditional set up - we now no longer remove the poles from the van

Darran

[Perfect Windows]

No I couldn't get anything to work very well

I did this - set the univalve up tight to the end of section 1 - used a short piece of hose just past pole base - - on the hose I used John guest fitting - had trouble getting a rectus fitting to work - lots of self releasing and it was really too tight a fit in the pole
because the univalve does not fit inside section 1 a tubeless doesn't work - I have ground 2 flats on a univalve so it goes inside section 1

I have (for now) abandoned tubeless and returned to a more traditional set up - we now no longer remove the poles from the van

Darran

Cheers, Darran, thanks for the explanation. That makes sense. I guess the Univalve takes up some of the missing space as well.

I asked Ova if they might consider providing the pole I wanted with the longer inner section from another pole. Not interested, so I'm giving the Phantom a try. It didn't occur to me that the problem would be the same and I forgot to account for the length of each clamp setting the tube inside it a little further away from the end of the pole.

I'll post a pic of the solution I'm printing up. Might be amendable to fit Ova poles but it largely works because I can (cheaply) buy tube the exact diameter of the inner Phantom pole section.

I'd hate to have to go back from hoseless, it would drive me mental. It's just so much better.

I'm slightly confused by "we now no longer remove the poles from the van"

Vin

[Splash & dash]

Nice mod vin

Why are gardiners doing goosenecks without a hole ?

Darran

So the people who use univalves don't keep snapping jets due to not putting something on the hose to stop it pulling on the jets!
I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

He does  still sell the old style goose necks but you have to buy the sections separately. I found drilling out the new style ones made them very fragrant they broke easily

[Smudger]

Vin -  The guys used to have their own personal pole - but it was probamatic with the extra 30 ft of pole hose to store in racking at the end of the day - a "tubeless" type system removed all that extra hose - however without a rectus on the end of the hose the reel would drain out overnight leaving large puddles in the unit - I brought blanks to be fitted at the end of the day but often for lost of forgotten to be put on the hose - so now I replaced the long length of pole hose with a permanent fitting and a rectus fitting between the pole hose and microbore - at the end of the day the pole now stays in the van - no one has a personal pole anymore the poles are dedicated to the vans - the only time they get disconnected is for backpack work

hope this makes sense

Darran

[robert mitchell]

I thought Alex said he intended to keep listing the goosenecks with the through hole as a spare part.

Correct 

The previous version angle adapter base part is still available to buy separately.

Hi Alex,

Is that while stocks last or for good?

Thanks,

Vin

Hi Vin

We do have a large stock of these - so the stock should last for many years. We also have the tooling all ready to run off extra batches if ever needed.

It will be interesting seeing what is being used for these sort of setups in 4-5 years time and whether these base parts will be needed anymore 

Something new on the horizon ?

[Walter Mitty]

Some years ago I got into the habit of using pole hose externally. Once you get used to it the tangles are infrequent, and you don't have to keep dismantling the pole nearly as often for cleaning. I've no way of measuring it but it wouldn't surprise me if it lengthens a pole's life due to lack of grit inside it from pole hose.
It's not for everyone and is probably an acquired taste.

[the king]

I don’t see the need for the new angle adapter the old worked perfect and exceed sold a hose stop

[johnny bravo]

just put the option in when ordering a  new pole .    new style or old style

[Lee GLS]

Vin -  The guys used to have their own personal pole - but it was probamatic with the extra 30 ft of pole hose to store in racking at the end of the day - a "tubeless" type system removed all that extra hose - however without a rectus on the end of the hose the reel would drain out overnight leaving large puddles in the unit - I brought blanks to be fitted at the end of the day but often for lost of forgotten to be put on the hose - so now I replaced the long length of pole hose with a permanent fitting and a rectus fitting between the pole hose and microbore - at the end of the day the pole now stays in the van - no one has a personal pole anymore the poles are dedicated to the vans - the only time they get disconnected is for backpack work

hope this makes sense

Darran

Do you not use use the pushfit joiner and the base of the pole anymore?

[Smudger]

no - they work well even with staff but the constant "forgetting" to place the blank on the pole hose just lead to constant puddles in the van and unit

Darran

[Stoots]

Tubeless has to be the most pointless concept in window cleaning.

Pole attaches to reel hose and it stays there almost forever. Why the need to disconnect ?

I only disconnect mine maybe twice a day to remove kinks .

[Lee GLS]

Tubeless has to be the most pointless concept in window cleaning.

Pole attaches to reel hose and it stays there almost forever. Why the need to disconnect ?

I only disconnect mine maybe twice a day to remove kinks .

I use a 22 for majority of my work but I do need to swap to a 35 a few times a week so it’s nice not having the pole hose kicking about in the back of my truck as it’s pretty tight for room in there and the pole hose would end up in one big knot.

[Smudger]

Tubeless has to be the most pointless concept in window cleaning.

Pole attaches to reel hose and it stays there almost forever. Why the need to disconnect ?

I only disconnect mine maybe twice a day to remove kinks .

I think you fail to understand the many ways people work - while we usually don't need to disconnect the pole during the working day (not even to unkink) we do have days where the backpack is used several times in a day for S/F/G cleaning  so a tubeless was more manageable - others I know use several different poles during their working day
BUT for me tubeless was ideal for easier and tidier storage of poles outside the van - using tubeless meant no mass of pole hose lying about on the floor of the "birds nest" around the brush head - when your trying to store 9 + poles this becomes a real problem

Darran

[Splash & dash]

Tubeless has to be the most pointless concept in window cleaning.

Pole attaches to reel hose and it stays there almost forever. Why the need to disconnect ?

I only disconnect mine maybe twice a day to remove kinks .

I think you fail to understand the many ways people work - while we usually don't need to disconnect the pole during the working day (not even to unkink) we do have days where the backpack is used several times in a day for S/F/G cleaning  so a tubeless was more manageable - others I know use several different poles during their working day
BUT for me tubeless was ideal for easier and tidier storage of poles outside the van - using tubeless meant no mass of pole hose lying about on the floor of the "birds nest" around the brush head - when your trying to store 9 + poles this becomes a real problem

Darran

Exactly totally agree we have a minimum of 9 poles per van if they all had hose attached it would be a nightmare, all our poles are hosless best thing since sliced bread could not work without it .

[tlwcs]

Tubeless has to be the most pointless concept in window cleaning.

Pole attaches to reel hose and it stays there almost forever. Why the need to disconnect ?

I only disconnect mine maybe twice a day to remove kinks .

What’s a kink?
I’m tubeless btw
Tony