[neil 47]

How many customers do you need on your data base before you become profitable? and dont need to advertise as much.    1) running a porti

2) a t/m

3)any other form of cleaning


Neil
cornwall building  up steadaliy

[Fintan_Coll]

I suppose really you could be profitable with just one customer, if that customer was putting enough work your way. I would say however for a one man show  ,something like three hundred regular customers at least. Again it depends on how well you can market to them, how well you can look after them and how loyal they are to you.

[Zach]

Hi Neil,

You don't have to answer me on these questions, rather use them to work out where you are and where you are going.

How much turnover do you want this year?
What pricing structure do you use?
What does your average invoice work out to?
How many jobs do you need to do in order to make up that turnover amount?
How will you go about getting that work?

etc etc.

I guess you'll have a pretty good idea of what your running costs are - including your fixed costs (that you will pay regardless of the amount of work that you get) and your variable costs (the additional costs each new job brings like fuel, chemicals and additional promotion work etc)

Use the figures that you have and apply them to where you want to be. That way you have a clear map of where you are going.

[Dynafoam]

Hi Neal,

Glad to hear that you workload is picking up  

The answer to your questions depends on the extent of repeat/referal work you generate.

For example I advertised once in 1965 and got 10 customers to act as guinea pigs for a machine I had built.

Every job I have done since has come from 9 of these (one left the country six days after the clean).

This is today something that would be hard to emulate, but I have frequently been told by other CCs that they rarely retrun to a customer.

The gap between these extreams is vast but a cleaners' position on this scale will affect the answer given.

John.

[Shaun_Ashmore]

John how do you get these core customers to keep refering you and keep having work done on a regular basis?

I have certain clients that I have worked for years but I could never rely on them to go out and get me hundreds of other clients a year so I advertise by YP and database marketing.

Shaun

[Fox]

Hi guys

Sorry to be a pain - (I'm not really)  but this is the area in which us 'general cleaners' (as you like to call us) come out on top!  We take alot longer and alot more effort and marketing to get our work but our invoicing is for work carried out throughout a 52 week period -  guaranteed payments all the way through even if a shut down occurs (unless we get sacked ofcourse)

[Ian Gourlay]

I believe you need a data base of 400 customers minimum.


However more would be better.

Regarding Johns pont of not returning to customers, I wonder why this is.

Poor workmanship

or poor marketing.

Regarding Foxey lady, good to see you on CC section.

Yes I believe contract, domestic and window cleaning you do know from month to month what your turnover is going to be and as such you have a more saleable asset. Although the hourly rate acheived for work is much lower.

I am not sure if a carpet cleaner with a data base od 500 recent customerts would have a business that could be sold for a sum of money in relation to turnover and profitability acheived during the year.

In other words Mr Bolton when you retire have you got a business you can sell.

Regards

Ian

[George-Reid]

Poor marketing is very easy to acheive.
When I was carpet cleaning we had a customer retention of about 70% the other 30% were not unhappy just did not see the need for regular cleaning.
To retain that 70% we would discuss the customers requirements after every job. Look at the  type of customer i.e. smoker non smoker kids in house single person etc. We would then book in the next clean frequency based on above. Their and then. We would confirm by letter within a week and a further letter 2 weeks before job was due to be done. In this way the customer has to cancel your visit instead of booking your visit. If they would not let us book in advance then used standard thankyou postcards after clean and recall system based on above frequency. Our business was manily fire and flood but useing above system after 5 years had in the region of about 1000 regular domestic customers.

Cheers
George

[Dynafoam]

Shaun,

Without being in any way secretive, it is hard to say what exactly maintains the referal rate, or to be more precise, what did in the early days.

I suppose it must be the WOW factor - the ability to exceed expectations, bolstered up with a bit of showmanship. For example, I always wear white cotton socks, and before leaving the house I walk over the carpets without shoes, then display the clean, dry, white cotton of the soles.

Nowadays, when many of my clients are third-generation and I am a friend of the family, loyalty is easier to maintain and many times I get a phone call asking if it is ok to pass my number to a friend as it is well known that I do not take on "strangers" (hense no signwriting on my van).

I obviously do nothing to convince my customers that it is anything but a privilage to be on my 'approved clients list'.

John.

[Bryan H]

I think John has hit it on the head in five words.  "The ability to exceed expectatations'  ( I hope you don't mind me paraphrasing you John ?) but I believe it's one of the main keys to success in this business.   Under promise & over prove, works every time.

We could all spend a small fortune on various marketing ploys, but if the client is not pleased with the work, then it's money down the drain.
I have a database of around 1500 going back 15 years, not large, but as 95% of my work is repeat & referral, this is ample.

Apart from a £250 Y/p ad which provides the other 5%,  I have spent no other money on any other form of advertising in at least 10 years.  I don't even send reminders now.

I guess I am just plain lazy as regards marketing. I sit & wait for the phone to ring; fortunately it does!  When first starting out it takes a fair time for the repeats & referrals to build up, & I had many a sleepless night in the early years wondering where the next job was coming from, especially when I was a franchisee & had royalties to pay.

I believe if you do a 'good job' at a fair price, are polite , considerate & reliable then customer loyalty must surely follow & rewards will be reaped in later years.

Everybody's aspirations are different.  If you want to make it rich, I am sure the opportunities are here in this business to do so.  Personally I am just happy to make a decent living without flogging myself half to death.  But then I am 'old' now.

Bryan

[paulchambers]

Bryan sounds like you mange to get it right i also sit and wait for the phone to ring and it doesnt    got a a letter to try from another member to try. problem is just moved to cornwall and dont know anyone yet . so i must keep pushing until i find what works only want 3 jobs aweek so not asking for much

[Doug Holloway]

Paul,

Without wishing to sound negative I think you are aiming so low that you do not have a strategy to get work as you feel you only need a bit.

There is a nuclear theory relating to critcal mass(bombs) which basically says that below a certain level nothing happens and above it becomes spontaneous.

Aim higher and you will be pleasantly suprised.

Cheers,

Doug

[paulchambers]

umm i see your point but when you have delivered leaflets every day for 2 weeks and get no response it gets you down a bit but will will aim higher

[Bryan H]

Paul

I think you are going to find it a little harder in an area like Cornwall.  My stepmother lives in North Cornwall & has her carpet cleaned occasionally (Too far for you to go I'm afraid)  but at half the price I would charge in Berkshire.

I didn't mean to infer that I have always had it this easy.  In the early years I worked like a dog putting myself about & making contacts.  I am afraid the luxury of sitting & waiting for the phone to ring only comes with time, and after hard work earlier on.  But stick with it if you can, and give it a bit of time.  I wish you all the best,  you will do it !!

Bryan

[paulchambers]

thanks bryan  me and mark are chatting if you fancy a chat

http://groups.msn.com/CARPETCLEANERS/chat.msnw?r=1

[Derek]

Paul

Rather than just drop leaflets through the domestic potential customer's doors which if the return is low (and it is known to be so) this is going to be disheartening try something else as well...if only for a break.

Why not visit your local retailers carpet and upholstery, Upholsterers, Letting agents and other organisations who could provide you with work..
When I first started, a good many years ago now, I hadn't been going long when suddenly ...BANG..  the telephone stopped ringing... for two solid weeks I had no work so I spent my days trawling every one of the organisations mentioned above in the whole County.

I picked up a little work to to tide me over then the recession picked up a little.... suddenly all the folk I had called on were on the telephone and I didn't know which way to turn first.

Just keep plugging away but try several avenues... remember the old saying about "chickens in one basket"?  

Cheers
Derek

[Dennis]

and when the work does pick up, and if you keep at it it will, don't stop marketing!

By the way the answer to the original question is 42.  
(Hitch Hiker's Guide To The Galaxy)

[Dynafoam]

Paul,

Following Dereks advice about personal visits, instead of simply pushing a piece of paper through a letterbox, why not present the potential domestic customer with a real person.

Knock on the door, explain that you are an experienced CC who has recently re-located and are introducing yourself as thier local CC, no special 'half price' offers no gimics, just a good job at a fair price - could you give them a quote so that if they need your services at some time they will know how reasonable your charges are.

Most houses you will not get beyond the doorstep, but you can still be the nice man who left his phone number.

The houses you do get into, you can impress them with your professional survey and knowledge. some may book then and there, others, like Dereks' prospects may take a little time to mature.

You may be surprised the effect of getting just one job can make to your demeanour and outlook.

I am no expert in this form of marketing, nor any other form that does not take place on a customers' premises, but when all else seem to be failing...............

The very best of luck to you.

John.

[neil 47]

I just want to thank you all for your replys, it has given me a lot of information that I will listen too and act on .
once again thanks
ps some very good points george
Neil
   learning every day    

[Doug Holloway]

Paul,

I make leaflets work and do believe that whats on the leaflet does matter very much.

I would respectfully sugest that if your leaflet is like your web site with the jp american approach, that the good folk of Cornwall may prefer the opposite no bull approach.

Pm me your private address and I will send you a leaflet.

Cheers,

Doug