[Sir Squeaky]

I worked out my tax bill and submitted it, and it was a shocker (for me anyway).

No chance of writing a cheque, so I phone up to sort out a payment plan.

It's been split into 3 months of £300-odd a month.
Also on July 31st they want another £350.

That's around £1200, and my tax bill was only £675.
I'm never going to be able to spare £75 a week, every week for 6 months.

Last year it was £450-odd, I wrote a cheque, they send me a receipt saying nothing owing.
Now she says there's extra to pay from last time, yet I never had any correspondence telling me so.
They can't just add £300 to my bill, then make up another mystery £300 too...

Should I go to Citizens Advice about these conning b'stards?

Rog. (who should have a weight off his shoulders, not more bloody stress )

[crystal.clear]

your lucky i just paid my tax bill over £5000

[Tosh]

Rog,

Don't worry about it too much.  The taxman isn't as bad as some other financial firms I could name.

I've been through the 'haggling' stage with the taxman, and failed to keep to my end of the agreement.  In the end, I missed payments and then just paid them what I could till my balance was cleared.  They don't hassle you.

Just pay them what you can, ensuring that you pay them enough to clear your tax balance prior to getting your next tax bill.

You may get a bit of interest added, but they don't go sending the balifs round.

You've got nothing to worry about.

If I were you, I'd  pay 'em 150 quid per month, at least, every month, till you've cleared your balance.

[chosker]

We had problems like this once or twice. give them a call and ask them to send you a breakdown of exactly why you owe that much money.

They do want payment at the time they request it, and although they will arrange payment plans they charge more for this.

Their argument is... well, you know what month your tax returns are due so you should be prepared for it. Only advice I can give is to have a seperate bank account and siphon off x amount a month so that when your tax bill comes its all there ready and waiting to be paid over to them. Any extra money you have in there can pay for your holiday  

If you have a receipt saying nothing else owed then confront them about it and send them a copy / fax of the receipt. There's not a lot they can say to hard evidence like that

Our tax bills run into the thousands but we've learned over the years to set aside money each month...

Good luck!

[Pj]

Rog, the Tax office base the balance you owe on the accounts you submitted.  As long as you keep your records in good order it shouldn't be too hard for you to work out what you should have paid.  If you think youv'e been over taxed you can appeal, or re-submit, they can rebate you next year. 

[KarlJones]

Should I go to Citizens Advice about these conning b'stards?

Yes.  And I will tell you that not because you might get some off but because you might get a better explaination.

Remember that your paying the balance of the year 2005/2006 and also making a first payment on year 2006/2007.  This can catch you with your pants down,  because if you made a big purchase in the year 2005/2006 prior to January it would lower your first payment on account compared to the final bill.

Now this is a wierd thing. 
My Dad always files his tax returns at the end of May.  This is because if you file them before the end of September then the inland revenue do the calculations for you.  This then usually flies backwards and forwards, lots of nice conversations on the phone ect, basically no one seems to file anything with them in May except my Dad so things move quite nicely and any explainations on both parts are handled well.  By the time September comes his is already sorted.

It gives him plenty of time to make arangements for any nasty supprises.

[marc al]

  I always have mine filled out and returned within a week of receiving the forms.

  Why wait till the last minute, if you keep your books upto date it is very easy to just transfer the figures over.

   I was told what i had to pay by mid September, that way if you are looking like you will come up short you have alot more time to sort it out.

   Although I believe the tax man is always honest and will not take a penny more than they are supposed to, it is best not to get on the wrong side of them as this may well flag you up in the future as a pain in the arse and time for a bit of an investigation.

[MNWC]

Just paid half of mine tonight

Tried to ring their helpline but been engaged for the last two days !!

so paid half my commitment today, sent them a letter explaining
my payment plan
 
x amount for feb

x amount for march

Sure ill have to pay a little interest (was about 11 quid last year)

They seem happy with that

Marcus

[williamx]

You could borrow a wfp system, you should make that amount within 2 weeks.

[niceandclean]

Should I go to Citizens Advice about these conning b'stards?

Now this is a wierd thing. 
My Dad always files his tax returns at the end of May.  This is because if you file them before the end of September then the inland revenue do the calculations for you.  This then usually flies backwards and forwards, lots of nice conversations on the phone ect, basically no one seems to file anything with them in May except my Dad so things move quite nicely and any explainations on both parts are handled well.  By the time September comes his is already sorted.

It gives him plenty of time to make arangements for any nasty supprises.

Thats what i do!!

[DaveWilkinson]

The tax man gets a bad reputation but on the whole as long as you keep him informed he will normally be ok.

I was in a partership a few years ago and we had differences that couldnt be resolved. Anyway afterwards I couldnt get access to the accounts and couldnt file a return to the tax man, I explained this and there responce was they would estimate how much I owed and had to pay that, the only problem with this was they could re calculate at anytime they wanted and as many times as they wanted and send me another bill until I submitted my accounts for that year.

    I couldnt file accounts i didnt have and I couldnt guestimate as this was possible tax fraud......checkmate.

The only way out of it was to let the IR bankrupt me and start a new tax record, this cost 12k IR bill and by the time the receiver had piled his charges on the bill was estimated at 50k. I negotiated with the receiver but it still cost me 32.5k to settle plus solicitors costs.

Moral of the story is no matter what happens keep your accounts upto date and in a safe place.

Dave

[Jon T.C.]

I worked out my tax bill and submitted it, and it was a shocker (for me anyway).

No chance of writing a cheque, so I phone up to sort out a payment plan.

It's been split into 3 months of £300-odd a month.
Also on July 31st they want another £350.

That's around £1200, and my tax bill was only £675.
I'm never going to be able to spare £75 a week, every week for 6 months.

Last year it was £450-odd, I wrote a cheque, they send me a receipt saying nothing owing.
Now she says there's extra to pay from last time, yet I never had any correspondence telling me so.
They can't just add £300 to my bill, then make up another mystery £300 too...

Should I go to Citizens Advice about these conning b'stards?

Rog. (who should have a weight off his shoulders, not more bloody stress )


Rog,

I your liabilty is over £500, you pay half that amount again in lieu of next year ( £250).
So Jan 31, you are liable £750. Then July 31 another £250. That then means that £500 is already paid towards the following year. That is exactly what I had to do this year.

Regards Jon

[KarlJones]

Jon, is that just the liability on the final payment?  What I mean is if you over pay in July do you miss this trap?

[Paul Coleman]

I worked out my tax bill and submitted it, and it was a shocker (for me anyway).

No chance of writing a cheque, so I phone up to sort out a payment plan.

It's been split into 3 months of £300-odd a month.
Also on July 31st they want another £350.

That's around £1200, and my tax bill was only £675.
I'm never going to be able to spare £75 a week, every week for 6 months.

Last year it was £450-odd, I wrote a cheque, they send me a receipt saying nothing owing.
Now she says there's extra to pay from last time, yet I never had any correspondence telling me so.
They can't just add £300 to my bill, then make up another mystery £300 too...

Should I go to Citizens Advice about these conning b'stards?

Rog. (who should have a weight off his shoulders, not more bloody stress )

It sounds like you have fallen foul of the "payment on account" which hit me quite hard this time too.  This can be particularly nasty when you had a poor year the previous year and a much better year more recently.  I had a very bad year two or three years back due to a severe health problem.  When that was resolved, I then had a much better year.  The payment on account can work OK when you go from an OK year to a bad year.  Indeed, last January, I didn't owe them anything.  This January, I've just had to fork out £2,700+ .  My payment "on account" was actually larger than the first half of my tax bill.  It would probably be more helpful if the IR were to spread the payment on account over the two payment dates in January and July.  However, if you are going from an OK year into a very bad year, this could cause a problem.
Squeaky.  I think that the IR charge a 5% surcharge on any money not paid by February 28th.  You might be better off if you apply for a credit card with some credit card cheques and a special offer.  There are plenty out there still.  You could get interest free for 6 - 12 months though there is often a 2 - 3% charge on using those cheques.  If you are disciplined with making the repayments to the card, you could save yourself paying the IR the 5% surcharge from March 1st and save yourself paying them the interest.  IR interest rates are reasonable but getting a card (and CC cheques) on a special offer should be cheaper.

[Sunshine Cleaning]

Why not get an accountant, they will save you more than they cost, submit your accounts VERY early as suggested and do a bit more work.

[Sir Squeaky]

Why not get an accountant, they will save you more than they cost, submit your accounts VERY early as suggested and do a bit more work.

I stopped using accountants because they weren't worth it actually.
Might be a help for a 3 man £75K business, but for a lone ranger with a simple job?
Nah!

[Jon T.C.]

Jon, is that just the liability on the final payment?  What I mean is if you over pay in July do you miss this trap?

No. It all depends if your liability to pay that particular year is over £500.

[KarlJones]

thanks Jon.

I worry when I see statements about accountants saving more than they cost.  Sure they may spot the odd thing you have not realised you can claim but they cost a fair ol whack.

[Paul Coleman]

thanks Jon.

I worry when I see statements about accountants saving more than they cost.  Sure they may spot the odd thing you have not realised you can claim but they cost a fair ol whack.

I probably break even on my accountant but it's the aggravation he saves me that is what I pay for.
Although I could sort out basic accounts and returns form directly with the IR, I would have to spend time going to their office for some of it - particularly issues on capital items.  On top of that, I have occasionally had letters from the IR where I needed a translator.  There are a few things he has put through that I wasn't aware of.  Also, I rented my flat out for a few years some while back and he was a great help with that (for a higher fee mind).
My bill for his most recent year was £224.00 - which is tax deductible.  To have someone cost me the equivalent of about £150 p.a. (after tax and lesser NI bill), and save me hassle is worth it to me.  I can earn more than that on a decent day.

[Sunshine Cleaning]

Why not get an accountant, they will save you more than they cost, submit your accounts VERY early as suggested and do a bit more work.

I stopped using accountants because they weren't worth it actually.
Might be a help for a 3 man £75K business, but for a lone ranger with a simple job?
Nah!

Your choice of course, but why not submit your accounts earlier so that you know how much tax you have to pay well in advance.
If you know in July how much , then you have 6 months to save up.

I cant understand why anybody leaves it till late January to work out how much Tax they will pay a week later, especially someone who has no money.

[Sunshine Cleaning]

Something is seriously wrong if a window cleaner is paying £450 in tax/NI 04/05.
That works out at net (after expenses) £7400 .
http://www.listentotaxman.com/index.php?calc=1&year=2004&isMarried=1&isWidow=1&age=0&add=1000&taxcode=&period=1&ingr=8400&Submit=Calculate
To be paying £660 tax/NI 05/06 earnings would be £8500 ish net / 9500gross.
http://www.listentotaxman.com/index.php?calc=1&year=2005&isMarried=1&isWidow=1&age=0&add=1000&taxcode=&period=1&ingr=9500&Submit=Calculate

Thats not a massive amount of money even if your partner is working.

It's an average of £180 per week before expenses.

It's not much of a living.

Your problem as has been noted is you creeped over the threshhold and now like most people you have to pay "on account" basicly double. One half added to Jan the other in July.

Dont forget you have already earnt this money up to the end of March 06.

To calculate how much next Jan/July will be click here, http://www.listentotaxman.com/index.php?isMarried=1&isWidow=1&isBlind=0&isStudent=0&calc=1&year=2006&age=0&add=1000&taxcode=&ingr=10500&period=1&chart=0&payrise=0&gr=10500

Lets say you earn £1000 more, yor total liability will be £884. You will have to pay this split over Jan/July plus the balancing payment of £220 in Jan.

So that will be £660 Jan and £440 in July.

Each year you earn more you pay the balancing payment in Jan.


Dont forget the site above is for PAYE and NI is taxed at 12% not 8% so the final figures will be out but it gives a basic calculation for the year ahead.

let

[macc]

You could borrow a wfp system, you should make that amount within 2 weeks.

Good idea, What do you think Rog?

The answer to your problems 

[Pureandclean]

My accountant told me the Tax office were going to be on strike today, must be because today is their busiest day, and they don't fancy having to break into a sweat 

Blessings,

Graeme

[chosker]

Yep they are on strike and like an idiot i left my tax return till today... never done it before and never will again...

What happens now cos i called them earlier and they aren't taking any returns today, surely they can't give you a penalty for handing it in tomorrow if they're on strike    or would they say you should have done it earlier???

[Tosh]

Of course they can't fine you as long as your tax return arrived there TODAY.

It says on the form it's got to arrive there by the 31st Jan.

But if it arrives tommorow, I reckon you've got an extra hundred quid to cough up.

[chosker]

We have always been ok to just put it through the door of our local tax office on the night... if they get it before midnight its ok.

Anyway, not as bad as i made it sound, having thought about it, my tax return was done on line, its just the payment they wont get till tomorrow. Apparently they don't penalose you for this, but they charge interest... i'm sure one days worth of interest will be peanuts!

[Tosh]

Ahhh, I've just opened my mail and find I've just had a smacked wrist from the Gwent Magistrates Court!  (I'm sure I live in Monmouthshire though??)

I've been fined 50 quid for the following:

Self Assessment 2nd Payment on Account 2005/2006.

Amount unpaid 193.61. 

Interest there on under Section 86 TMA 1970 0.03 per day 35.09

Cost of this Summons 50 quid.

Total278.70

The rotten dirty scumbags.  If I don't cough up before the 16 May 2007, I've got to appear at the Court House in Abergavenny!

Crickey, it was only a couple of hundred quid I owed!

I guess I'd better cough up.  I thought I'd get at least another letter warning me first!

[adixon]

if you get an accountant you claim the money back anyway so youve lost nothing my accounts were done this year for £150 and the fee was deducted from my tax bill and any problems go back to them sorted not worth the stress of doing yourself

[EasyClean]

I work part time hours because of my long term illness and 'squeeky cleans' tax bill looks like pocket money compared to my tax bill. Does squeeky clean work part time hours too??? Or does he clean windows the traditional way-hence the small tax bill!!!!!!!!!

[Paul Coleman]

We have always been ok to just put it through the door of our local tax office on the night... if they get it before midnight its ok.

Anyway, not as bad as i made it sound, having thought about it, my tax return was done on line, its just the payment they wont get till tomorrow. Apparently they don't penalose you for this, but they charge interest... i'm sure one days worth of interest will be peanuts!

I have sometimes found the IR lacking when it comes to losing paperwork.  I always take my cheque into their office and get the receipt signed and dated.  It's no hassle.  I can see their office from my living room window.

[KarlJones]

if you get an accountant you claim the money back anyway so youve lost nothing my accounts were done this year for £150 and the fee was deducted from my tax bill and any problems go back to them sorted not worth the stress of doing yourself

You can claim it ALL back?  the whole 150 quid?

[Sunshine Cleaning]

I dont think it comes directly off the tax bill, but it is 100% allowable expense.

[WavieDavie]

Squeaky,

Here's some tough love for you . . .

There's nothing more certain in life than death and taxes, so don't complain you didn't know you would have to pay.

You know how much you make each week and so you should have put enough away into a high-interest account and MADE money on the back of the taxman before you had to hand it over.

Because there's now a black mark on your file at the tax office, and you're in a cash business, there's a better chance of you getting an investigation sooner rather than later. I don't think accountants fees for representing you at investigations ARE tax-deductable, and they sting!, but maybe someone else can confirm.

If what you quoted is the real amount you should be paying, the taxman won't believe that you're making less in self-employment than you would in a dead-end job.

If you can't afford to pay your tax bill, how are you putting anything away for your future?

All this slagging off wfp . . . you just can't afford it. Get a bank loan, or buy a system on a plastic card and pay it back over a year or so.

And now, the toughest bit - frankly, you'd be better off working for someone else.

Don't shoot the messenger.