[Ken_Long]

Need to get a new brush head shortly so have been having a look at what's available. Usually buy Gardiner but am put off by the £7 plus vat delivery cost. A boggo Gardiner brush with delivery and vat is now £50 which just seems ridiculous.
I have looked about, WCW seem even more expensive.
Am I missing something? It's just a plastic block with plastic bristles, how can it be £50?
Has anyone got any sensible recommendations for brush heads that (1) will do the job and (2) not cost as much as an Mot?

[Splash & dash]

Unfortunately it’s the way everything is going we buy most things in bulk now to last a year or so , this way the postage is the same , and if things go up in price or arnt available we have stock do it’s not a pr, I totally agree about brush prices but in the grand scheme of things you should be able to pay for a brush with less than an hours work  and hopefully the brush will last 2-3 months so looking at it like that it’s not quite so bad

[Slacky]

2-3 months?

I think what Im currently using is probably a year old.

[Smudger]

but its not just a couple of bits of plastic is it...

the bristles are usually of a high spec - the stock is lightened and has mouldings to take jets - by all means go get a standard kitchen broom head - drill some holes in it for jets fit it to your pole and see how long it lasts....

Vikan is your best bet for cheap but the penalty is its heavy and not a good window cleaning brush - pays ya money takes ya choice

Darran

[Smudger]

2-3 months?

I think what Im currently using is probably a year old.

2 to 3 months - sounds about right as splash works for a living - not flouncing around all day 

my streamlines last around 6 months
(well my personal brush is now 4 years old and still looks like new  )

Darran

[Slacky]

I'll settle for flouncing around. 

[Ken_Long]

I don't know, £50 still seems too much. I realise spread over 3/6/12 months the cost per use is low, but it is just a plastic molding with bristles and a coupe of holes. It's not lovingly handcrafted by some hipster artisan in east London, who only crafts 4 a year from recycled Mercedes interiors and polar bear fur . They're churned out in a Chinese factory by the thousand. I need to get in to the WFP brush market I think.

[nathanharrison]

Ken

Feel free to look into production/design and manufacturing costs and get loads made for half the price. You could even put £5 on the price of each head for your time and pocket. I'm sure you would make a killing on here. I for one would buy a couple per year from you 

[Splash & dash]

2-3 months?

I think what Im currently using is probably a year old.

Hot water and working 8 hours a day 5 days a week they last 2-3 months , we do some serious work 😂😂😂

[Richard iSparkle]

I don't know, £50 still seems too much. I realise spread over 3/6/12 months the cost per use is low, but it is just a plastic molding with bristles and a coupe of holes. It's not lovingly handcrafted by some hipster artisan in east London, who only crafts 4 a year from recycled Mercedes interiors and polar bear fur . They're churned out in a Chinese factory by the thousand. I need to get in to the WFP brush market I think.

if its just plastic and bristles then what is window cleaning?

just spraying some windows with water and charging £20?

gardiners and the rest need to make a profit that makes it worthwhile being in business... same as we do

also they aren't mass market they're commercial use so they dont shift the numbers that B&Q or Tescos and the like do for domestic goods

[Splash & dash]

Ken

Feel free to look into production/design and manufacturing costs and get loads made for half the price. You could even put £5 on the price of each head for your time and pocket. I'm sure you would make a killing on here. I for one would buy a couple per year from you 

Lol you have no idear what the tooling costs are to produce a brush it’s tens of thousands of pounds !!!!!! Go ahead and try you will soon think £50 a brush is very good value

[robbo333]

Need to get a new brush head shortly so have been having a look at what's available. Usually buy Gardiner but am put off by the £7 plus vat delivery cost. A boggo Gardiner brush with delivery and vat is now £50 which just seems ridiculous.
I have looked about, WCW seem even more expensive.
Am I missing something? It's just a plastic block with plastic bristles, how can it be £50?
Has anyone got any sensible recommendations for brush heads that (1) will do the job and (2) not cost as much as an Mot?

You could always go and get it and save yourself £7.

[dazmond]

ive just paid £165(inclu VAT and delivery) for 3 tapertec brushes,some rectus 26 connectors and some o clips......

suck it up mate or go and convert a broom brush!

[AuRavelling79]

2-3 months?

I think what Im currently using is probably a year old.

The Gardiners red one with the yellow bristles lasts "forever". 

[AuRavelling79]

I don't know, £50 still seems too much. I realise spread over 3/6/12 months the cost per use is low, but it is just a plastic molding with bristles and a coupe of holes. It's not lovingly handcrafted by some hipster artisan in east London, who only crafts 4 a year from recycled Mercedes interiors and polar bear fur . They're churned out in a Chinese factory by the thousand. I need to get in to the WFP brush market I think.

Think about this Ken - you wouldn't expect the brush to be free (obviously) so let's say you felt that £30.00 was reasonable and fair. So you are only unhappy about the extra £20 really, aren't you?

Also the final 20% goes to the government not into Alex's or the manufacturer's pocket ... AND you can claim 20% of the Vat inclusive total against tax.

[Stoots]

May as well just buy a new pole tbh

Seriously a brush can last 2 years or more for me so by the time I'm replacing it may as well.get another pole.

I agree 50 quid for a brush is too expensive

[Granny]

Look after them and get the most life you can out of them then.
I'm still using the first Gardiner Superlight I bought 10 years ago.
It works and I have had no complaints from customers.

[Jamie Thomas]

Your brush must be like triggers broom.  Its had 4 new stocks and 10 sets of bristles.

[dazmond]

Look after them and get the most life you can out of them then.
I'm still using the first Gardiner Superlight I bought 10 years ago.
It works and I have had no complaints from customers.

What's it like using it for awkward angle windows over kitchen extensions  and conservatories?I bet your pole bends like a banana...not to mention the strain on your shoulders...

I truly cant believe window cleaners are still using these heavy brushes on their poles....

[Spruce]

ive just paid £165(inclu VAT and delivery) for 3 tapertec brushes,some rectus 26 connectors and some o clips......

suck it up mate or go and convert a broom brush!

What happened to those Bentley brooms we use to get from Morrisons for £2.99? We used to throw the handle away and put two jets into the brush head. Some brushes would work better with age when the flocking of the bristles wore out, where others the bristles would tangle up and become a mess.

What I liked about them was they were so light.

Someone on that old DIY forum from years ago removed all the bristles from one with the idea of transferring all the bristles from a Vikan oval brush into it. He wanted the lightness of the Bentley brush stock and the quality of the Vikan bristles. He reported it as a failure, if I remember correctly.

[Stoots]

ive just paid £165(inclu VAT and delivery) for 3 tapertec brushes,some rectus 26 connectors and some o clips......

suck it up mate or go and convert a broom brush!

What happened to those Bentley brooms we use to get from Morrisons for £2.99? We used to throw the handle away and put two jets into the brush head. Some brushes would work better with age when the flocking of the bristles wore out, where others the bristles would tangle up and become a mess.

What I liked about them was they were so light.

Someone on that old DIY forum from years ago removed all the bristles from one with the idea of transferring all the bristles from a Vikan oval brush into it. He wanted the lightness of the Bentley brush stock and the quality of the Vikan bristles. He reported it as a failure, if I remember correctly.

That's how I started in 2014.

Alloy decorators pole, some 5mm garden tubing from b&q and a brush head from tesco. 

My next step was an six so I never really had the joys of using a clx thankfully.

[NWH]

We all started like that by converting a basic broom brush how do you think Alex pays to have his boat serviced 🤣🤣🤣🤣

[Spruce]

I don't know, £50 still seems too much. I realise spread over 3/6/12 months the cost per use is low, but it is just a plastic molding with bristles and a coupe of holes. It's not lovingly handcrafted by some hipster artisan in east London, who only crafts 4 a year from recycled Mercedes interiors and polar bear fur . They're churned out in a Chinese factory by the thousand. I need to get in to the WFP brush market I think.

Think about this Ken - you wouldn't expect the brush to be free (obviously) so let's say you felt that £30.00 was reasonable and fair. So you are only unhappy about the extra £20 really, aren't you?

Also the final 20% goes to the government not into Alex's or the manufacturer's pocket ... AND you can claim 20% of the Vat inclusive total against tax.

Interesting way of explaining it. You would have made a good car salesman Malc.

[NWH]

If you are making a 1000% on something the odd 20% to whoever isn’t too bad though is it.

[zesty]

I defo think £50 is too expensive, and I’m not at all struggling.

We’re currently renovating our house, and I’ve been amazed at how cheap tools and materials are from Screwfix, it’s crazy cheap.

Then a plastic brush with some bristles is £50?

Come on guys, of course they’re expensive, that’s not the issue though, the issue, as always with clean it up, is making it out like we’re all minted and £50 isn’t much to us. 

The above doesn’t change the fact that brushes are a complete rip off, but we need them, and that there is the reason they’re expensive, plus the fact the demand is lower (obviously) compared with tools and materials from a DIY store.

If Screwfix sold gardiner type brushes, they’d be around £10 if that.

It’s not about how much you earn, certain products are overpriced whether your’re a millionaire or on universal credit.

[Granny]

Look after them and get the most life you can out of them then.
I'm still using the first Gardiner Superlight I bought 10 years ago.
It works and I have had no complaints from customers.

What's it like using it for awkward angle windows over kitchen extensions  and conservatories?I bet your pole bends like a banana...not to mention the strain on your shoulders...

I truly cant believe window cleaners are still using these heavy brushes on their poles....

I thought you were the big athlete - weight lifting and whatever you're always going on about how strong you are and how many muscles you've got.
Worried about a few ounces on the weight of a brush!

[Ralphie]

you could always get together with H Man and knock something up, knock it out cheap and whilst failing at that get back on the glass to find someones pinched your round whilst you have tried to reinvent the wheel at a more cost effective price.

Or start a thread to bulk purchase to reduce costs of delivery, VAT etc.

Or just pay the £50.

[Smudger]

Yes £50 is expensive - however having been in the moulding sector I know the cost of tooling up - the initial outlay etc….

These brushes are in manufacturing terms “short runs” - they could and would easily just do standard brush heads in the millions

For me a lot of brushes are over engineered now with radius ends weird shapes etc….
A straight forward rectangle or lightweight sill brush would be fine for my use

Darran

[Perfect Windows]

I found this. What do you reckon that tooling would be? I'd guess a tenner, tops. Then a quid for the manufacture of each brush.

https://youtu.be/o7Gq1fTds28?t=10

I'm halfway through making one of those brush machines in the shed. I'll compete with Gardiners with my £3 brushes.

Vin

[EandM]

I defo think £50 is too expensive, and I’m not at all struggling.

We’re currently renovating our house, and I’ve been amazed at how cheap tools and materials are from Screwfix, it’s crazy cheap.

Then a plastic brush with some bristles is £50?

Come on guys, of course they’re expensive, that’s not the issue though, the issue, as always with clean it up, is making it out like we’re all minted and £50 isn’t much to us. 

The above doesn’t change the fact that brushes are a complete rip off, but we need them, and that there is the reason they’re expensive, plus the fact the demand is lower (obviously) compared with tools and materials from a DIY store.

If Screwfix sold gardiner type brushes, they’d be around £10 if that.

Scale of economy:

Screwfix potential UK cutomer base = 41 million

Gardiner potential UK customer base = 200,000 assuming all window cleaners are WFP

[dazmond]

Look after them and get the most life you can out of them then.
I'm still using the first Gardiner Superlight I bought 10 years ago.
It works and I have had no complaints from customers.

What's it like using it for awkward angle windows over kitchen extensions  and conservatories?I bet your pole bends like a banana...not to mention the strain on your shoulders...

I truly cant believe window cleaners are still using these heavy brushes on their poles....

I thought you were the big athlete - weight lifting and whatever you're always going on about how strong you are and how many muscles you've got.
Worried about a few ounces on the weight of a brush!

its just not a smart way to work IMO......your risking RSI using heavy brushes like the so called superlite brush

[NWH]

I defo think £50 is too expensive, and I’m not at all struggling.

We’re currently renovating our house, and I’ve been amazed at how cheap tools and materials are from Screwfix, it’s crazy cheap.

Then a plastic brush with some bristles is £50?

Come on guys, of course they’re expensive, that’s not the issue though, the issue, as always with clean it up, is making it out like we’re all minted and £50 isn’t much to us. 

The above doesn’t change the fact that brushes are a complete rip off, but we need them, and that there is the reason they’re expensive, plus the fact the demand is lower (obviously) compared with tools and materials from a DIY store.

If Screwfix sold gardiner type brushes, they’d be around £10 if that.

Scale of economy:

Screwfix potential UK cutomer base = 41 million

Gardiner potential UK customer base = 200,000 assuming all window cleaners are WFP

I would say that’s way out saying that they only have a market of 200,000,way out.

[james peters]

https://gardinerpolesystems.co.uk/xtreme-sill-26cm-brush-medium-soft.html
I have been using this one for about a month . my favourite so far , its been good on gutters too 

[EandM]

I defo think £50 is too expensive, and I’m not at all struggling.

We’re currently renovating our house, and I’ve been amazed at how cheap tools and materials are from Screwfix, it’s crazy cheap.

Then a plastic brush with some bristles is £50?

Come on guys, of course they’re expensive, that’s not the issue though, the issue, as always with clean it up, is making it out like we’re all minted and £50 isn’t much to us. 

The above doesn’t change the fact that brushes are a complete rip off, but we need them, and that there is the reason they’re expensive, plus the fact the demand is lower (obviously) compared with tools and materials from a DIY store.

If Screwfix sold gardiner type brushes, they’d be around £10 if that.

Scale of economy:

Screwfix potential UK cutomer base = 41 million

Gardiner potential UK customer base = 200,000 assuming all window cleaners are WFP

I would say that’s way out saying that they only have a market of 200,000,way out.

Estimated number of UK window cleaners

[zesty]

Yes, hence me saying demand is lower.

Saying that, gardiner sell in many countries. Including the US.

They’re still overpriced for what they are.

We can’t do without them, there isn’t much competition, so it is what it is, much to Alex’s delight!

[EandM]

Yes, hence me saying demand is lower.

Saying that, gardiner sell in many countries. Including the US.

They’re still overpriced for what they are.

We can’t do without them, there isn’t much competition, so it is what it is, much to Alex’s delight!

Yes, I was thinking about the UK market more than current exchange rates.
I doubt many of us could design, pay for the R&D, build and distribute a decent brush for £50.
Granted, it seems relatively expensive but then niche stuff always is.

[Rob.Hall]

Well I chuckled when I saw a second hand gardiners sill brush go for £47  on ebay the other day 😳 😊

Best buy now lads coz if fuel and food are anything to go by we will be chasing brushes!

[Spruce]

Well I chuckled when I saw a second hand gardiners sill brush go for £47  on ebay the other day 😳 😊

Best buy now lads coz if fuel and food are anything to go by we will be chasing brushes!

If we have any customers left

[NWH]

Won’t be long people will be saying do you remember when we had our windows cleaned once a month or 4 weekly you mean Spruce.

[Spruce]

Anyone priced up a Constructor brush recently?

[Spruce]

Won’t be long people will be saying do you remember when we had our windows cleaned once a month or 4 weekly you mean Spruce.

I think we are going to have a hard time looking at the rapid increase in the cost of living. Fuel has gone up by 4p a litre just this week. I read an article saying the spec price of gas had gone up by 500%.
This is not only affecting Britain but the rest of the world as producing countries are exporting less gas.
I'm already noticing that I'm chasing bad debt from those who paid regularly on line. I had a cheque bounce the other day.  The note I got back with it was "refer to drawer" and don't represent it. 
The wife works in purchasing. She says suppliers are quoting 40% and they have had to increase their prices by 30%. This reminds me of inflation we accepted back in South Africa.

[NWH]

This is what I’ve been saying about 4 weekly cleans a hell of a lot will have to double their workload as people imo will switch to every other month at best,or 6 weekly at the earliest.
Even in good times bang on 4 weeks-month is to often ok you’ll always get people that want that but not a round full of customers even less so in the future it never happens immediately after a down turn,from experience in the past it’s more like 3-5 years and 8-10 to start coming out of it.

[NWH]

I’m having 2 cross climates fitted later 370 instead of the usual 280.

[NWH]

I don’t know how people earning regular money survive how’s long is it going to be before  people will say a grand a week gets me by,worlds gone loopy.

[Simon Trapani]

I don’t know how people earning regular money survive how’s long is it going to be before  people will say a grand a week gets me by,worlds gone loopy.

We survive by using cold water😂

[KS Cleaning]

This is what I’ve been saying about 4 weekly cleans a hell of a lot will have to double their workload as people imo will switch to every other month at best,or 6 weekly at the earliest.
Even in good times bang on 4 weeks-month is to often ok you’ll always get people that want that but not a round full of customers even less so in the future it never happens immediately after a down turn,from experience in the past it’s more like 3-5 years and 8-10 to start coming out of it.

You’d be better looking closer to home. Perhaps the penny will finally drop for your well heeled customers who are paying you over £100 for an hours work 😉 …..I’m glad I don’t have all my eggs in one basket , I will stick to my mix of 4 weekly £10 a pop jobs ( as you put it ) along with my larger properties and commercial work. Also the bit about it taking 3-5 years before having an impact…wow! I think you’ve lost the plot😂

[NWH]

I wouldn’t think it’s much of a problem KS when someone’s down to their last 5-10 milllion,pay the window cleaner I think there’s enough cash in a pair of jeans I had on last week.

[Slacky]

I also think £50 is expensive for a brush but I also think I earn way over the top of what my time feels worth to me. Customers don't seem to mind though and thats what counts.

I did £185.00 this morning in 90 minutes, the rest of my week Ive been done and dusted by 13:00 every day, so why moan about a 50 squid brush....

[Rob.Hall]

Stop boasting Slacky 🤣
You will turn into NWH .

[the king]

If you want a brush to last a lifetime get the vikan ones But there dam heavy  i use the ultmate medium they last ages even with hot water