Cleaner Windows

  • Posts: 757
not in the rain :(
« on: December 11, 2006, 03:23:58 pm »
had one of those days today where to many ppl came out while we had cleaned at least three of their windows and said "erm..not today thankyou, its raining!" or "it may rain again in a week so theres no point"
earnt about £60 in total but gave up and came home cos i'd had enough :(
dont you just hate days like this??
when I'm cleaning windows

S_RICHARDSON

  • Posts: 980
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2006, 03:24:38 pm »
i despise them mate!!

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2006, 03:36:45 pm »

 can honestly say that 99% if not all my customers don't want and don't expect me to turn up in rain. But I won't tolerate "it might rain" merchants. Dry day...they get em done....rains tomorrow?....that's life!

Denis mate put your foot down on that one.

steveaqua

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2006, 03:50:00 pm »
i had a woman say last week, leave it and come back in February when the weathers better.

Cheap scate, like i ain't got christmas to go through as well as her!

so for the next three houses after i was thinking about how i'm gonna give her sh** when she asks me again in Feb to do her windows

I've had a few aggy customers in the last week or so, i had to cut my day short on Friday because of one, i was so wound up i thought if i go to another customers house and they pee me off there gonna get both barrels

stuff them, treat them the way they treat us!

pjulk

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2006, 04:08:48 pm »
Quote
erm..not today thankyou, its raining!

I can understand customers saying this and i agree with them.

Price the work right and rainy days can be a blessing just to get a day off.
We do other work on rainy days like inside's or gutter cleaning.
Or have the day off.

I have worked in the rain and to be honest i hate cleaning windows in the rain as i does not seem to me that the customers are not getting there moneys worth.

I know some won't agree saying clean in all weather.
We do just not outside windows when its raining.

Paul

geoffreyspecht

  • Posts: 485
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #5 on: December 11, 2006, 04:42:13 pm »
i always work in the rain

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #6 on: December 11, 2006, 04:49:38 pm »

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #7 on: December 11, 2006, 05:16:37 pm »

tomo

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #8 on: December 11, 2006, 05:20:59 pm »
when i got home i saw rain water had collected on top of the tarpoling of my ibc....i measured the tds and it was 002 good enough to clean windows with , which brings me to the age old" clean in the rain or not".

i went out last week and due to the combination of high wind and rain the windows's were not much cleaner after a few hrs. .... without the wind i believe you can still get a good finish even in the rain provided your sensible and it isn't lashing against the window....but imagine the possibilities if you could capture that rain water without it getting too contaminated  in this part of the world you could dispense with your ro all together we have had that much rain, now there' an idea.  if only

regards tomo

p.s the weather looks to be rubbish till next monday i don't much follow forecasts  but it does make  a grim outlook if you don't clean through the rain.

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #9 on: December 11, 2006, 05:23:43 pm »
I let as many customers know that i'm due for a customer cull. They dont refuse, even in wet.

dai

  • Posts: 3503
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #10 on: December 11, 2006, 05:27:00 pm »
.but imagine the possibilities if you could capture that rain water without it getting too contaminated  in this part of the world you could dispense with your ro all together we.

I have measured it coming down the downspout at 7 ppm. There is no reason that you could not pump it straght through the DI

tomo

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #11 on: December 11, 2006, 05:30:55 pm »
try it dai see how you get on ...i might follow ;D ;)

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #12 on: December 11, 2006, 05:32:38 pm »
I let as many customers know that i'm due for a customer cull. They dont refuse, even in wet.

Er....."Sunshine Cleaning?"  8) ;D

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #13 on: December 11, 2006, 05:36:48 pm »
Yes I provide the sunshine !!!! ::)

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #14 on: December 11, 2006, 05:56:33 pm »

Yes I provide the sunshine !!!! ::)

 ;D ;D ;D

I don't work in rain...!!!!

I reason that yer average wage slave is paid to do ish 2000hr per year.

So as long as I put in roughly 6hrs a day on average (over the year) then I'm happy to work 12hr days in the height of summer and scale back in the crappy wet, short days winters....it averages out!

And still earning more than I was as a bank clerk....and far far far more less stressy and relaxed about life.

pjulk

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #15 on: December 11, 2006, 05:57:30 pm »
Sunshine Cleaning said
Quote
Yes I provide the sunshine !!!!  ::)

But what about the cleaning  ;D

Londoner

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #16 on: December 11, 2006, 06:41:47 pm »
I think the answer is to make it clear when you start that this WFP ia better for a whole lot of reasons INCLUDING the fact that you can clean windows in the rain with it.

"Oh yes missus it works in the rain becuse it uses pure water and we don't have to dry the glass off afterwards......"

Anyway, Thats going to be my new years resolution (well one of them anyway). To give that speel to every new customer and try and get a lot tougher about this rain issue. I'm sure if you start the way you intend to carry on most customers won't question it.

The other new years resolution concerns the blonde who lives at no 35 but I can't tell you about that one

macc

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #17 on: December 11, 2006, 06:48:28 pm »
I think the answer is to make it clear when you start that this WFP ia better for a whole lot of reasons INCLUDING the fact that you can clean windows in the rain with it.
 I'm sure if you start the way you intend to carry on most customers won't question it.



Its been a year now & my customers in general know as long as its not lashing it down i work & they are ok now. They are used to it now.  ;D

Most dont even care, so i get on wiyh it.

Macc

D woods

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #18 on: December 11, 2006, 06:52:11 pm »
Hi Guys
What do you do if we get a week or two of really bad rain? If you don't work
how do you pay your mortgages and feed your families?

EasyClean

  • Posts: 558
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #19 on: December 11, 2006, 06:57:11 pm »
i had a woman say last week, leave it and come back in February when the weathers better.

Cheap scate, like i ain't got christmas to go through as well as her!

so for the next three houses after i was thinking about how i'm gonna give her sh** when she asks me again in Feb to do her windows

I've had a few aggy customers in the last week or so, i had to cut my day short on Friday because of one, i was so wound up i thought if i go to another customers house and they pee me off there gonna get both barrels

stuff them, treat them the way they treat us!

Put her price up and tell her it's a new price because she's not classed as a regular customer anymore so she can't keep her regular price, her fault for not being a loyal customer. fairs fair!!!!
Losing a customer is like waiting for the next bus, another one will come along shortly!

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #20 on: December 11, 2006, 06:58:24 pm »
From dough put aside from the kind summer months....surely one budgets?

Fast 1 *

  • Posts: 667
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #21 on: December 11, 2006, 07:23:13 pm »

Yes I provide the sunshine !!!! ::)

 ;D ;D ;D

I don't work in rain...!!!!

I reason that yer average wage slave is paid to do ish 2000hr per year.

So as long as I put in roughly 6hrs a day on average (over the year) then I'm happy to work 12hr days in the height of summer and scale back in the crappy wet, short days winters....it averages out!

And still earning more than I was as a bank clerk....and far far far more less stressy and relaxed about life.
Thats quite a good way of looking at it.
I personally dont work in the rain either,people dont like it.Winter seems to be the great enemy for window cleaning.I think you have to earn your serious money in the summer
wildstyles

eddie d

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #22 on: December 11, 2006, 07:25:51 pm »
work in all weathers .

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #23 on: December 11, 2006, 07:31:45 pm »
work in all weathers .

Power to yer elbow Guv....but not for me! :-*

Fast 1 *

  • Posts: 667
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #24 on: December 11, 2006, 08:07:19 pm »
I cant help thinking it looks a bit unprofessional doing windows when its chucking it down,not only that it makes you look a bit desperate.
wildstyles

captain lard

  • Posts: 304
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2006, 10:40:11 pm »
I cant bring meself to do it in the rain and am miles behind but never mind,fingers crossed its nice tomorrow.

niceandclean

  • Posts: 1897
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #26 on: December 11, 2006, 11:26:59 pm »
I always clean in the rain. I have had a couple of customers say not today as its raining, but i say that when i come round next time it will be double the regular price. Have not had a customer recently say not today. But i do now tell all my new customers that we clean in all weathers and if its raining its raining, they will still be cleaned. Not had any problems, i think if you tell them to begin with they accept it.

Cleaner Windows

  • Posts: 757
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #27 on: December 11, 2006, 11:28:38 pm »
but those ppl who say not to day etc...how would they feel if they went into work  at a hospital and were greeted by their employer at 8 a.m just to be told "sorry, not this week, as there may not be any emergencies, so go home and you wont be paid for this week!"

a bit over the top but you understand my reasoning!!
when I'm cleaning windows

Cleaner Windows

  • Posts: 757
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #28 on: December 11, 2006, 11:33:30 pm »
builders have to carry on in the rain most of the time unless its really hard rain all day etc so why shouldnt we?
we cant control the weather nor can anyone else..i do understand that its a bit of an arse when they are cleaned and get dirty again after its rained but thats life. it doesnt rain all the time does it! if you provide regular service and do a good job, then what is the problem really? why cant they just maybe not give a xmas tip or summit?
when I'm cleaning windows

niceandclean

  • Posts: 1897
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #29 on: December 11, 2006, 11:34:51 pm »
Maybe you need to send out a letter to your customer's in question, and explain that if they are to be a regular customer then you will be cleaning in all weathers. If they dont want a clean that day then it will be double the price next time. You have a waiting list of people who want a regular window cleaner and you do not want to have to cancel them to take on another one.

Ian_Giles

  • Posts: 2986
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #30 on: December 12, 2006, 06:28:36 am »
I clean in light rain, drizzle and so on, really depends how windy it is.
If it is raining quite heavy, but there is no wind, then I will at least finish what I am doing, I wouldn't go out and start a days work on domestic work if it was hammering down.
Increase the severity of the weather, storm force winds and so on, and I know I am wasting my time, and that goes for when I know full well I have, say just a couple of hours to quickly knock out a bit bit of work.

I personally think it is wrong.

I'm not going to clean windows that I know full well going to be dirty again within half hour of me cleaning them, or mucked up before they have even dried out (I'm WFP)

Dennis,
Builders don't work in the rain, or rather they can only work in conditions that are suitable for the work they are doing.
You can't paint in the rain.
If you are glossing you only have a small window in the day when you can do that even when it isn't raining in the winter, condensation kills gloss.
So foggy damp weather is also a no-no.
You can't lay bricks in the rain, or plaster in the rain, you are probably at the mercy of the weather to a greater degree than us window cleaners.
Prior to window cleaning I was in construction, and the family business has only just been closed down after close to a hundred years.

Other professions are also at the mercy of the elements, scaffolders, farmers and so on.
There are times when they are also delayed because of inclement weather.

We are no different.

Ian
Ian. ISM CLEANING SERVICES

Trevor Knight

  • Posts: 1825
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #31 on: December 12, 2006, 07:46:00 am »
We ALWAYS work in the rain.

Our customers are told we work 12 months of the year regardless of the weather, unless its torrential. We work if its raining.

Guy's come on, this is your income. If you clean a house in the morning and an hour later the weather changes and it honks it down, do you go back to those customers an give them a refund??? Be honest, when its raining, probably 25% of the windows in your house are affected by the rain and thats due to the direction. Are you really telling me after its rained your windows are filthy with dirt and grime, your window sills are black again??

If you went through a car wash an 10 mins later it rained and you went back to ask for a refund they would laugh at you.

If you have the space to shift your work about and don't fancy the wet weather then thats fine, but if your working a tight round and need to get out tell your customers your working to ensure you are keeping in with their schedule and as promised, relaible!

Its all down to your own personal beliefs as to what you think is right or wrong. I personally believe I won't get away not paying my bills or feeding my family as it's been a bit wet lately.

Happy days, come on the sunshine  ;)
Covering Hampshire, Dorset, Surrey, Berkshire

Ian_Giles

  • Posts: 2986
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #32 on: December 12, 2006, 09:21:46 am »
Got to disagree with Trev here, at least in part.
I think the arguement is flawed to say that you have bills to pay, it's my job and I'm doing it come hell or high water.
As some others have said, if I had a window cleaner and he turned up to clean my windows in the conditions we have experienced of late, then I would tell him not to bother this time.
If he used the arguement that Trevor uses to justify working, and further said something along the lines of, 'I'm only prepared to do regular work, if you are goingto use the weather as an excuse not to have your windows cleaned then you will have to find another window cleaner.'
I'd feel angry and frustrated that I was literally being blackmailed.
If I agreed to his demands, I'd probably drop him at the first opportunity, particularly if I paid him a tenner, and by the time he'd loaded up his van my windows were grubby and dirty again :-\

Now if that is the way I feel, then I am not going to subject my DOMESTIC customers to something I myself would object too.

However; Should a customer come out to me and say, 'No thanks mate, it's going to rain tomorrow.'
When I've turned up on a perfect window cleaning day then I'd probably not bother coming back the following month.

The car wash analogy isn't a good one, if I take my car into the car wash, that is my personal choice, might be different if someone turned up and cleaned my car in bad weather :P

Commercial work is different, and particularly shops, some are done more than once a week, I'll do those in a monsoon without a qualm, with strict contract work you have to.
Domestic can drift in the winter, that is of course unless the customer wants to stick rigidly to a day or date, in those circumstances, they are done whatever the weather.
On my top end commercial accounts I'll also not risk jeapordising them by cleaning them in really poor conditions, though I will clean them in conditions that I would have second thoughts about on domestic work.
On offices you are often contracted to clean them monthly, but you can usually getthem done in the week you are supposed to get them done in.

Ian
Ian. ISM CLEANING SERVICES

Trevor Knight

  • Posts: 1825
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #33 on: December 12, 2006, 09:43:01 am »
Got to disagree with Trev here, at least in part.
I think the arguement is flawed to say that you have bills to pay, it's my job and I'm doing it come hell or high water.
As some others have said, if I had a window cleaner and he turned up to clean my windows in the conditions we have experienced of late, then I would tell him not to bother this time.
If he used the arguement that Trevor uses to justify working, and further said something along the lines of, 'I'm only prepared to do regular work, if you are goingto use the weather as an excuse not to have your windows cleaned then you will have to find another window cleaner.'

I know where your coming from  Ian and its a fair point, I still believe though that if they are due to be done then they are done. Otherwise you will have a backlog of customers who will be expecting you to be able to just catch up and clean them as exected. then you get customers saying, your a week late, i've found someone else now.
I'd feel angry and frustrated that I was literally being blackmailed.
If I agreed to his demands, I'd probably drop him at the first opportunity, particularly if I paid him a tenner, and by the time he'd loaded up his van my windows were grubby and dirty again :-\

Honestly Ian, come on mate be fair, do you truely believe that a drop of rain will make your windows grubby and dirty? Next time it honks it down, clean your own windows and tell me they are grubby and dirty the next day. I am looking out of my office window now having had a heavy downpour yesterday and they are fine?

Now if that is the way I feel, then I am not going to subject my DOMESTIC customers to something I myself would object too.

However; Should a customer come out to me and say, 'No thanks mate, it's going to rain tomorrow.'
When I've turned up on a perfect window cleaning day then I'd probably not bother coming back the following month.

The car wash analogy isn't a good one, if I take my car into the car wash, that is my personal choice, might be different if someone turned up and cleaned my car in bad weather :P

Commercial work is different, and particularly shops, some are done more than once a week, I'll do those in a monsoon without a qualm, with strict contract work you have to.
Domestic can drift in the winter, that is of course unless the customer wants to stick rigidly to a day or date, in those circumstances, they are done whatever the weather.
On my top end commercial accounts I'll also not risk jeapordising them by cleaning them in really poor conditions, though I will clean them in conditions that I would have second thoughts about on domestic work.
On offices you are often contracted to clean them monthly, but you can usually getthem done in the week you are supposed to get them done in.

Ian

Before I adopted my "clean when it rains" attitude I used to say to customers, "look, I know its raining, if you're not sure about me cleaning them now, tell you what, i will clean them, wait until tomorrow and if you think they are still dirty I will re-clean them, if however, they are clean please send me a cheque" Being truthful I reckon I have had to re-clean about half a dozen windows in the 15 years I have done this?
Covering Hampshire, Dorset, Surrey, Berkshire

Helen

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #34 on: December 12, 2006, 10:13:58 am »
Make it clear from when you take on new customers that you do work in all weathers, if that is what you do. If you don't then tell them!
The only time we stop is when daylight fades, the rain is horizontal or we have gale force winds. We are a 12 month business and the majority of our customers understand that. Saying that we do get the odd one, who makes a comment about cleaning in the rain. They get 2 chances, we think that is fair, 2 refusals and off they go ;D
As for frames etc being black as soon as you have cleaned them? ???, that is why we impress on our guys that if you spend that little bit of time each clean making sure the tops of frames and surrounds are totally clear from dust etc then you will not get a problem when it rains.
Suggestions for you for those customers:
Not in the rain thankyou (when you have already cleaned some), OK, but the charge is £xxx for those I have already done.
Not in the rain thankyou (when you haven't started) ok, would you like the insides done instead then (sometimes it works!
It MIGHT rain, so no thank you!!!!!! Oh mr/mrs customer, I wish I could tell when it would rain, as I would be making a fortune weather forecasting and not cleaning windows! ;D

Ian_Giles

  • Posts: 2986
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #35 on: December 12, 2006, 11:44:47 am »
Trev, I also know where you (and Helen) are coming from...sigh!

Don't have time to continue the debate!!!

I'll try to later, got to get back to work!

(Thought out debate is much better than arguement isn't it? ;))


Ian
Ian. ISM CLEANING SERVICES

Trevor Knight

  • Posts: 1825
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #36 on: December 12, 2006, 11:46:36 am »
Trev, I also know where you (and Helen) are coming from...sigh!

Don't have time to continue the debate!!!

I'll try to later, got to get back to work!

(Thought out debate is much better than arguement isn't it? ;))


Ian
;D I look forward to continuing our argument, I mean, conversation, I mean debate, I mean, oh whatever, look forward to your reply  ;D
Covering Hampshire, Dorset, Surrey, Berkshire

[GQC] Tim

  • Posts: 4536
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #37 on: December 12, 2006, 12:45:45 pm »
I clean in light rain, if it's not too windy.

My customers are informed, as it is mentioned on the cleaning chit.

Quote
Hello, your windows were cleaned today* :

Amount owed   : £....................................


-   Please make cheques or postal orders payable to
   T van Duijvenbode and write your address on the reverse side.

-   Paypal / Nochex : gqc-cleaning@hotmail.com
       - (Under £15, there is a 50p charge) -

-   Bank Transfer:  Please put first line of address under payment reference
        Sort Code : xx-xx-xx   Account Number :  xxxxxxxx


PLEASE PAY WITHIN 5 WORKING DAYS

*GQC Window Cleaning will clean your windows at our agreed frequency throughout
the year;  regardless of the weather; ensuring you have a regular, fully insured and
professional service from us.

However, if we are  turned away without prior notice (48hr  advance) or good reason
there will be a 25% surcharge against the next clean
.


simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #38 on: December 12, 2006, 03:09:20 pm »

Gotta say this subject has been kicked to death!

Some do....some don't....some do....some don't.....

I DON'T AND NEVER WILL.....will I become rich with this attitude?...no!....am I bothered?....no!....will I have the odd midweek day off?....yes!....did I earn enough during the long dry summer months to compensate for this?....yes!

Because of this crappy weather we've all been having I'm now over 120 jobs behind and most won't be done this side of 2007 and there's a chance a few customers will go elsewhere. But I reckon that for every one that goes away there'll be 10+  that'll be pleased I didn't show up in p##sing-down-bleeding-awful-weather!

enough already




Dominic

  • Posts: 71
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #39 on: December 12, 2006, 03:26:25 pm »
Always work whatever the weather. Don't see how you can keep up a reliable service any other way. Always tell customers when we take them on so they are prepared. Got equipment debts so have to keep the pennies rolling in. I now love working in the rain cos there's not so many people to get in our way. Don't like getting behind on work either.

D.

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #40 on: December 12, 2006, 03:44:33 pm »
Always work whatever the weather. Don't see how you can keep up a reliable service any other way. Always tell customers when we take them on so they are prepared. Got equipment debts so have to keep the pennies rolling in. I now love working in the rain cos there's not so many people to get in our way. Don't like getting behind on work either.

D.

Oh come on Dominic, you can't have it both ways...you either:

a) Need the money and don't mind getting wet and doing a less than 100% job.
b) Offer a reliable service, but surely a "reliable" service also means that the customer gets 100% satisfaction....not possible in rain! 

john tomkins

  • Posts: 1639
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #41 on: December 12, 2006, 04:04:29 pm »
that is why we impress on our guys that if you spend that little bit of time each clean making sure the tops of frames and surrounds are totally clear from dust etc then you will not get a problem when it rains.



I agree with you generally but with the excessive wind and rain conditions we are experiencing lately I've noticed on my own newly cleaned windows that the rain is washing down the brickwork and depositing a load of brick dust/dirt all over the windows leaving them in a terrible state, if I was a customer I would not be pleased with that, so no I'm not working in the rain, I'll finish a job in the rain but not start the next one.

Paul Coleman

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #42 on: December 12, 2006, 05:19:08 pm »
I had a few customers who would send me packing if rain threatened.  Some of those would also get on my case if I was late.  They can't have it both ways.  One of them was deeply religious so I went around to clean on a Sunday just to annoy her.  Got the sack eventually and was glad to see the back of that one.

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #43 on: December 12, 2006, 05:24:15 pm »
I had a few customers who would send me packing if rain threatened.  Some of those would also get on my case if I was late.  They can't have it both ways.  One of them was deeply religious so I went around to clean on a Sunday just to annoy her.  Got the sack eventually and was glad to see the back of that one.
Like it   ;D

Ian_Giles

  • Posts: 2986
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #44 on: December 12, 2006, 05:58:50 pm »
Trev,
You are quite right, a drop of rain is niether here not there, I've worked in the rain today...though I'm feeling guilty about the last account I did, it was exposed and really catching the wind and rain :-\

If the rain is so hard its soaking the walls above the windows, it's highly unlikely you'll be cleaning windows in conditions like that...you'd be mad to in fact.

But the wind picks up debris from fields, fron passing cars, off trees and hedgerows  , roofs and walls, it gets swirled high into the atmosphere, mixes with the rain and is driven onto the windows.

Now as every one knows, I am a keen advocate of WFP, but I'm also honest enough to look at things with an unbiased eye (that applies to trad too I'll have you all know!)

WFP does not cope well with windy, stormy conditons, yes, you CAN go out and work in conditions that would be madness off a ladder, but the trade off is the much greater potential for low standard work.

I do my local Spar shop, was doing it last week (in & out) WFP on the outside, but I squeegee the doors as they open out and get stinking, so better safe than sorry.
On calm days the windows on the outside dry out perfect, I can't fault them.

But on this day, the doors were good (not perfect because of the heavy wind and rain) and the big window to the one side of the doors was also nearly perfect (I'd squeegee'd this one off) but the big window the other side of the door had noticable spots when looked at from the inside after they had dried out. (the other window and the doors only failed on very close inspection)

The wet glass will hold onto crap, it takes a little longer for the squeegee'd windows.
I do lots of insides and I notice the difference between work done in squally conditions and that done in fine conditions.
I want the work I do to be acceptable by my own standards, I don't like charging for work that I know doesn't achieve those standards.

I did a house a couple of weeks ago, she wasn't in (I still haven't been paid either >:() and as I called back on her to see if she was in at the end of the day, I saw a couple of windows that were not quite right, no one about So a quickly tidied them up and checked over the rest of the house.
They had all dried out perfect, was a bit windy but not too bad.
Last Wednesday I was going past the house and popped in on the off chance of making the collection, I didn't, she was out, it had been less than a week and the windows were minging :o
I was stupidily grateful to the fact that I had called back on the day I did them and found them spotless   (bar a couple of panes on two windows) otherwise I would have been thinking I had done a terrible job, looked just like I'd done a slipshod WFP job.
But of course that was all down entirely to the weather.

We have to have some give and take, customers have to accept their windows are going to potentially get dirty very quickly in the winter, but I think we should also consider the fact there are some days when you have to just take it on the chin and not work.
Just lately the weather has been pretty exceptional, it's why the two threads on weather are getting so many hits!
And of course the pressure is really on us all to get as much work done as possible because of the financial pressure of Christmas (JW's notwithstanding of course! ;))

These are conditions when shops are a real godsend 8)
I have plenty of them (and offices, pubs and so on) so I can afford to be pusillanimous ;)

Ian
Ian. ISM CLEANING SERVICES

dai

  • Posts: 3503
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2006, 06:05:55 pm »
I will carry on working unless it's really lashing down.
I tell my customers that if I was to stay at home every time it rained I would have to increase my prices considerably to cover my loss.
I did tell customrs when I switched to WFP that it was an all weather tool.
It's ok saying price your work right and take the time off, they don't want to pay the right price though do they?
I now have a weeks work more than I need. I'm weeding out the not today brigade.
If you do this, you will eventually have all customers that accept you working in all weathers.
I only earned £79 today because of it lashing down.
If they want a window cleaner that only works when the sun shines, I wish them the best of luck in finding one. Dai

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #46 on: December 12, 2006, 06:21:19 pm »
I will carry on working unless it's really lashing down.
I tell my customers that if I was to stay at home every time it rained I would have to increase my prices considerably to cover my loss.
I did tell customrs when I switched to WFP that it was an all weather tool.
It's ok saying price your work right and take the time off, they don't want to pay the right price though do they?
I now have a weeks work more than I need. I'm weeding out the not today brigade.
If you do this, you will eventually have all customers that accept you working in all weathers.
I only earned £79 today because of it lashing down.
If they want a window cleaner that only works when the sun shines, I wish them the best of luck in finding one. Dai

So are you saying Dai that customer satisfaction comes secondary to you earning?

Cleaner Windows

  • Posts: 757
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #47 on: December 12, 2006, 08:19:27 pm »
I will carry on working unless it's really lashing down.
I tell my customers that if I was to stay at home every time it rained I would have to increase my prices considerably to cover my loss.
I did tell customrs when I switched to WFP that it was an all weather tool.
It's ok saying price your work right and take the time off, they don't want to pay the right price though do they?
I now have a weeks work more than I need. I'm weeding out the not today brigade.
If you do this, you will eventually have all customers that accept you working in all weathers.
I only earned £79 today because of it lashing down.
If they want a window cleaner that only works when the sun shines, I wish them the best of luck in finding one. Dai
;D ;D 8)
when I'm cleaning windows

Paul Coleman

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #48 on: December 12, 2006, 10:50:08 pm »
I will carry on working unless it's really lashing down.
I tell my customers that if I was to stay at home every time it rained I would have to increase my prices considerably to cover my loss.
I did tell customrs when I switched to WFP that it was an all weather tool.
It's ok saying price your work right and take the time off, they don't want to pay the right price though do they?
I now have a weeks work more than I need. I'm weeding out the not today brigade.
If you do this, you will eventually have all customers that accept you working in all weathers.
I only earned £79 today because of it lashing down.
If they want a window cleaner that only works when the sun shines, I wish them the best of luck in finding one. Dai

So are you saying Dai that customer satisfaction comes secondary to you earning?

ot trying to do Dai's writing for him but my service only exists while it is economically viable for me to provide it.  Therefore the choice is to price much higher and take the time off or work in wet weather up to a point.  The other alternative is that the service ceases to exist.  Others may try to provide that service but would probably flounder on the same obstacles.  If it's a reasonable bet that the windows will get dirty over the few days following a clean, at least a window cleaner is preventing a build up of dirt.  The customer is paying a sort of retainer to prevent such a build up occurring.

Trevor Knight

  • Posts: 1825
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #49 on: December 13, 2006, 08:48:27 am »
Trev,
You are quite right, a drop of rain is niether here not there, I've worked in the rain today...though I'm feeling guilty about the last account I did, it was exposed and really catching the wind and rain :-\

If the rain is so hard its soaking the walls above the windows, it's highly unlikely you'll be cleaning windows in conditions like that...you'd be mad to in fact.

But the wind picks up debris from fields, fron passing cars, off trees and hedgerows  , roofs and walls, it gets swirled high into the atmosphere, mixes with the rain and is driven onto the windows.

Now as every one knows, I am a keen advocate of WFP, but I'm also honest enough to look at things with an unbiased eye (that applies to trad too I'll have you all know!)

WFP does not cope well with windy, stormy conditons, yes, you CAN go out and work in conditions that would be madness off a ladder, but the trade off is the much greater potential for low standard work.

I do my local Spar shop, was doing it last week (in & out) WFP on the outside, but I squeegee the doors as they open out and get stinking, so better safe than sorry.
On calm days the windows on the outside dry out perfect, I can't fault them.

But on this day, the doors were good (not perfect because of the heavy wind and rain) and the big window to the one side of the doors was also nearly perfect (I'd squeegee'd this one off) but the big window the other side of the door had noticable spots when looked at from the inside after they had dried out. (the other window and the doors only failed on very close inspection)

The wet glass will hold onto crap, it takes a little longer for the squeegee'd windows.
I do lots of insides and I notice the difference between work done in squally conditions and that done in fine conditions.
I want the work I do to be acceptable by my own standards, I don't like charging for work that I know doesn't achieve those standards.

I did a house a couple of weeks ago, she wasn't in (I still haven't been paid either >:() and as I called back on her to see if she was in at the end of the day, I saw a couple of windows that were not quite right, no one about So a quickly tidied them up and checked over the rest of the house.
They had all dried out perfect, was a bit windy but not too bad.
Last Wednesday I was going past the house and popped in on the off chance of making the collection, I didn't, she was out, it had been less than a week and the windows were minging :o
I was stupidily grateful to the fact that I had called back on the day I did them and found them spotless   (bar a couple of panes on two windows) otherwise I would have been thinking I had done a terrible job, looked just like I'd done a slipshod WFP job.
But of course that was all down entirely to the weather.

We have to have some give and take, customers have to accept their windows are going to potentially get dirty very quickly in the winter, but I think we should also consider the fact there are some days when you have to just take it on the chin and not work.
Just lately the weather has been pretty exceptional, it's why the two threads on weather are getting so many hits!
And of course the pressure is really on us all to get as much work done as possible because of the financial pressure of Christmas (JW's notwithstanding of course! ;))

These are conditions when shops are a real godsend 8)
I have plenty of them (and offices, pubs and so on) so I can afford to be pusillanimous ;)

Ian

Hi Ian,

Fair points and valid ones. I understand exactly what your saying.

I guess on this one we will agree to do things our own way. I will work in the rain until my customers complain, like previous postings I have never experienced any real flack so happy days.

The pressure on xmas is a very valid on, we are working from daylight til nightfall as we finish on Friday 22nd and don't eturn until after the new year so we are getting all our months work done early. We do this every year and our customers are fine with this, they no we will be early in the month as we want a holiday too!

Onwards and upwards, have a good day today, its dry  ;)
Covering Hampshire, Dorset, Surrey, Berkshire

dai

  • Posts: 3503
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #50 on: December 13, 2006, 06:48:08 pm »
So are you saying Dai that customer satisfaction comes secondary to you earning
Some customers will moan for sure, but I have to make a living or they won't have a window cleaner at all. The answer would be to increase my prices by 25% and then I could afford to lose 3 months a year to the weather.
The moaning about cleaning in the rain would be nothing compared to a 25% price hike.
The weather here in north Wales has been appalling for the last three weeks.
We had 5/12 inches of rain in just one night. The wind has been howling for most of the time too.
The odd day off is neither here nor there, but when you get a prolonged spell like we are having now, decisions have to be made. I have ot experience a spell like this in 14 years.
It's ok saying you won't work in the rain, but there is a limit to how much time you can lose, and still run a viable business. Dai

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #51 on: December 14, 2006, 05:01:58 pm »

Dai, sorry if I came across rudely as it wasn't my intention. For what it's worth I tend to work really long hours in the summer on the basis that in winter I'm gonna be rained off 1 or 2 days a week. Mind you the with the weather you've described in N.Wales I'd probably rapidly adjust my attitude if I earnt nowt for a week!

Blimey 5 1/2 inches in one night?!!!


Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #52 on: December 14, 2006, 05:20:44 pm »
It's ok saying you won't work in the rain, but there is a limit to how much time you can lose, and still run a viable business. Dai


I agree with Dai, but would like to add that any customer who complains about getting their windows cleaned at this time of year; given the weather we've had is:

a.  Tight.

b.  Stupid.

c.  Dropped.

macc

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #53 on: December 14, 2006, 05:44:58 pm »
It's ok saying you won't work in the rain, but there is a limit to how much time you can lose, and still run a viable business. Dai


I agree with Dai, but would like to add that any customer who complains about getting their windows cleaned at this time of year; given the weather we've had is:

a.  Tight.

b.  Stupid.

c.  Dropped.

All 3

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #54 on: December 14, 2006, 06:03:15 pm »
It's ok saying you won't work in the rain, but there is a limit to how much time you can lose, and still run a viable business. Dai


I agree with Dai, but would like to add that any customer who complains about getting their windows cleaned at this time of year; given the weather we've had is:

a.  Tight.

b.  Stupid.

c.  Dropped.

a. Tight foremost...after all if you said "I know it's peeing down so I'll do em for nowt" They're hardly gonna say "no thanks!"

Can't comment on b

With c: I suspect it's how much the customer is worth annually that dictates how readily one drops. eg: I have a customer...Swedish, who absolutely has NO interst in her windows being done from Oct-Mar. But from Mar-end Sept she'll want em done 4 times @ £50 a throw....£200...how can I drop her?


Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #55 on: December 14, 2006, 06:11:53 pm »

With c: I suspect it's how much the customer is worth annually that dictates how readily one drops. eg: I have a customer...Swedish, who absolutely has NO interst in her windows being done from Oct-Mar. But from Mar-end Sept she'll want em done 4 times @ £50 a throw....£200...how can I drop her?

If 50 quid is a good price if you're happy with it and you've agreed a schedule of cleans, then don't drop her.  Maybe you would've charged less if she had it done every month?  The extra charge could be for the extra muck you've got to clean from her windows in March?

You've got to use some common sense.

But I don't do time-wasters; I don't care about the size of the account or how much I like the job or money.

If I'm turned away from an account, I drop them.  Cheeky monkeys!

It's been at least a year since I've had this happen to me; but I'm still cross from the times this HAS happened to me.

simon knight

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #56 on: December 14, 2006, 07:32:16 pm »

Time wasters? They get the heave ho...always!

I tend to "finesse" my customers almost bi-monthly. And with me it's always a bit of:

a) Are you regular?....and here I'm not too fussed whether it's 6/8/10/12 weekly....as long as I know where I stand.

b) Is your house a place I can do "comfortably"....ie I don't feel unduly endangered.

c) Can I park?....important in SW London

d)....and THE most important, how much am I likely to earn from you over the next 12 months.

It's all a bit Ad Hoc but I'm very reluctant to drop a customer until he/she can be replaced with something more pleasing to me....and even then I don't drop them as such. They don't get a call and as and when they call me the price gets adjusted to compensate for above.

john tomkins

  • Posts: 1639
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #57 on: December 14, 2006, 10:15:10 pm »
Had my first one this week say "not this month I've had loads of bills to pay/weather aint too good" it really wound me up but as I've only been at this game a few months I really have to bite my lip as I aint got enough customers to just drop any.....but he will be on my hit list for the future >:(

Cleaner Windows

  • Posts: 757
Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #58 on: December 14, 2006, 10:16:28 pm »
lol, i know what you mean chap!!!
when I'm cleaning windows

Paul Coleman

Re: not in the rain :(
« Reply #59 on: December 14, 2006, 10:42:02 pm »
Had my first one this week say "not this month I've had loads of bills to pay/weather aint too good" it really wound me up but as I've only been at this game a few months I really have to bite my lip as I aint got enough customers to just drop any.....but he will be on my hit list for the future >:(

The problem with a situation liker this is not so much being turned away once only but the probability that they are testing the boundaries for doing it again in the future.  I have found that when there is not a very good reason for stopping me working, it inevitably happens again and again from the samer place.  At least it used to anyway.  I won't put up with it so much these days.
Now I do agree that any customer has the right to say "not today thank you".  That is fine.  However, I also have the right to take whatever steps are necessary to maintain the profitability of my business.  The customers who I have difficulty with are those who only seem to be aware of their own rights and think that I am not allowed to cancel the job.