spindle

  • Posts: 680
chasing payment
« on: August 17, 2011, 02:08:59 pm »
hi guys

i did a job in january for a well known member of this forum.. the bill was around £800. i have spent the last few months chasing/calling him... my calls are not being returned.

i have been quite reasonable and patient but now its not funny... its been 8MONTHS

i dont know how  to continue pursuing this issue...

i hope by posting here it may put a rocket up his a$$.... you know who u are!!!!
life is one big learning experience!!!!!!!

from edge2edge

  • Posts: 1507
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #1 on: August 17, 2011, 02:27:32 pm »
Has he said why he hasnt paid you

Helen

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #2 on: August 17, 2011, 02:30:22 pm »
hi guys

i did a job in january for a well known member of this forum.. the bill was around £800. i have spent the last few months chasing/calling him... my calls are not being returned.

i have been quite reasonable and patient but now its not funny... its been 8MONTHS

i dont know how to continue pursuing this issue...

i hope by posting here it may put a rocket up his a$$.... you know who u are!!!!

.


Understand your frustration, but I don't think the rest of want to know who this is, so I hope you won't be posting names etc.
Why not write the guy a final demand and send it registered post, so that you have a receipt. In all honesty if we had worked for someone in January and not had payment by end of April, they would have been taken to court by now! Sometimes you can have too much patience :)

Ian Gourlay

  • Posts: 5748
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #3 on: August 17, 2011, 02:47:00 pm »
The problem is being on The Forum we all like to think we know one another and if it is a well known member you like to think you are in the Club

this a Cyber space  so we do not really know somebody Helen is right use the law as I believe we would have to delete post if you named and shamed, for legal reasons

That said I am still awaiting £250  from someone I know not on The Forum so you just cannot tell.

supernova77

  • Posts: 3547
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #4 on: August 17, 2011, 02:50:34 pm »

David_Annable

  • Posts: 689
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #5 on: August 17, 2011, 03:05:51 pm »
Hi
 
Yes Moneyclaim for me too!!

 Dave
NCCA, Woolsafe, IICRC Leather Cleaning Technician

Steve Chapman

  • Posts: 1743
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #6 on: August 17, 2011, 03:28:38 pm »
Have had to use Moneyclaim twice in last few months, in both cases there was a phone call and payment in within a few days,

Would've of loved to see their faces when it came through the post  ;D

Both cutsomers were well of types but just pushing their luck a bit...

Steve

wynne jones

  • Posts: 2918
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #7 on: August 17, 2011, 03:42:41 pm »
This is a very sad tale. Many people on here have worked for each other, put work each others way and swapped valuable knowledge, but when the unscrupulous do this kind of thing it's unforgivable. 7 months and no contact means taking you as a mug, there can't be any excuses.

You will probably be paid out of the blue now and they will get away with it. Then some other trusting soul will become their next victim.

It's not expensive, you just can't afford it.

derek west

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2011, 04:09:09 pm »
sorry but is it only me that wants to know who it is.  ;D

richy27

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #9 on: August 17, 2011, 04:15:16 pm »
what he said   

Helen

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2011, 04:15:46 pm »
sorry but is it only me that wants to know who it is.  ;D

No, you are not alone, but it wouldn't be right :)

derek west

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #11 on: August 17, 2011, 04:21:05 pm »
helen, i understand where your coming from, it would only cause chaos on the forum so mark! email me the answer and i'll keep shtum. ;D  derek@affordablecleaners.co.uk

clinton

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2011, 04:34:15 pm »
Yes its not right not paying your debts and chasing them..Its frustraiting too.

Derek ;D


wynne jones

  • Posts: 2918
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #13 on: August 17, 2011, 04:37:53 pm »
sorry but is it only me that wants to know who it is.  ;D

No, you are not alone, but it wouldn't be right :)


The only reason not to name and shame is to give Spindle maximum leverage to get his money back. In terms of right and wrong anyone who does that to a fellow board member and is not in contact offering the money doesn't deserve anonymity. I can think of only major illness or a bereavement in the family that would knock someone for six for so long.
It's not expensive, you just can't afford it.

Helen

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #14 on: August 17, 2011, 04:55:34 pm »
sorry but is it only me that wants to know who it is.  ;D

No, you are not alone, but it wouldn't be right :)


The only reason not to name and shame is to give Spindle maximum leverage to get his money back. In terms of right and wrong anyone who does that to a fellow board member and is not in contact offering the money doesn't deserve anonymity. I can think of only major illness or a bereavement in the family that would knock someone for six for so long.

Seeing as Spindle has had no call backs (which is wrong) it could be exactly that.
Other than that it should be dealt with in a correct legal manner and not spread over a general forum.
Spindle -  I really hope you get your money
Whoever owes him - please contact Spindle and let him know what is going on, after all aren't we meant to be professionals on here :)

Helen

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #15 on: August 17, 2011, 04:57:38 pm »
helen, i understand where your coming from, it would only cause chaos on the forum so mark! email me the answer and i'll keep shtum. ;D  derek@affordablecleaners.co.uk

Shhhhhsh, don't let anyone know, but you have our e-mails to forward it on to :)

Doug Holloway

  • Posts: 3917
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #16 on: August 17, 2011, 05:19:13 pm »
Hi Chris

As annoying as this is it woul not be a good idea to put any names on here, as this is effectively a matter between two individuals.

I would write and give a deadline for payment before pursuing the legal route.

Cheers

Doug

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #17 on: August 17, 2011, 06:08:26 pm »
If I were you I'd make it clear that you will name and shame if the individual doesnt pay up by a certain date. There is no legal reason the board needs to worry about as they only provide a platform. Plus, you could say, 'I did a job for x for £800 and he hasn't paid me.' Provided it is facutually correct no one can say diddly squat.

Simon

Steve Gunn

  • Posts: 850

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #19 on: August 17, 2011, 06:14:34 pm »
Exactly.
Anyway, the rumour mill will soon reveal who this person is and there are ways of saying things without actually saying it ;) ;)

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #20 on: August 17, 2011, 06:55:29 pm »
perhaps we can narrow it down by all coming here and declaring it wasn't us......

Then by a process of elimination whomever is left must be the guilty party, and then we all descend upon him (or her) and swing him (or her) by the gonads until the money is dispensed from his tight pockets.

If it is a her.......... slap her about a bit till she coughs..

 I will start

It isn't me........................................

garyj

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #21 on: August 17, 2011, 07:36:42 pm »
I can remember a thread like this years and years ago and how surprised we were when we found out who it was.

Can't remember who it was now though.

That's a lot of money to lose, hope you get it.


Re: chasing payment
« Reply #23 on: August 17, 2011, 08:24:17 pm »
Can't be Gary, he's never awake during day light hours to organise anything ;D
In fact he doesn't even answer his mobile like this afternoon (I was in Andover and would have called in - wheels ;))
BTW it wasn't me, unlike some on here I'm not so swamped with work that I can afford to pass it on or sub it out.

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #24 on: August 17, 2011, 08:36:52 pm »
Might be closing in ;D
Did Steve Barnett offer to do this job but 'someone else' had already got it??? (leather, bleach springs to mind)

Carpet Dawg

  • Posts: 2968
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #25 on: August 17, 2011, 09:09:35 pm »
Would be funny if the person owing the money comes on and says it wasn't me! ha ha

It wasn't me by the way!!

p.s. sorry to hear it mate. Its alot of money, I hope you get it soon.

Tony

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #26 on: August 17, 2011, 09:10:07 pm »
Might be closing in ;D
Did Steve Barnett offer to do this job but 'someone else' had already got it??? (leather, bleach springs to mind)
Keep going, Sherlock :D

mike roberts

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #27 on: August 17, 2011, 09:19:07 pm »
Sorry new to this forum... 8 months seriously.

Someone said give him a deadline eh!!! its been 8 months!!

If it is an individual trading as a company charge a late payment fee + interest incurred ... this is law your right as a company no q. Send new invoice including these fees enforce thro small claims court they will include the fees.

Surprisng how soon they pay when you add payment fee + interest we have used it with ISS cleaning and DHL , and yer I think it is in everyones interest to know who is / are late payers  :D ... We have now refused to work for ISS (shower :-X) and charge DHL extra as terms are now 60 days- happy to say this as they are aware of it !

Steve Barnett (Carpet Care Plus)

  • Posts: 1834
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #28 on: August 17, 2011, 09:30:52 pm »
Nothing to do with me, never knocked anyone for work, even when I've been knocked by the client I've still paid my suppliers and labour.

Knowing what type of work Chris does, I have an idea who it might be - lets hope they do the decent thing.

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #29 on: August 17, 2011, 09:31:54 pm »
Neil............. what is wrong with the following sentence.....

Gary.............. awake................... organise................ ??












 :o :o :o

Simon Moat

  • Posts: 167
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #30 on: August 17, 2011, 10:06:08 pm »
Wouldn't happen up North, we're all gentlemen!

wynne jones

  • Posts: 2918
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #31 on: August 17, 2011, 10:19:14 pm »
So the phone goes tomorrow and it's one of our 'highly respected' CIU buddies asking if you want £1k of commercial work. Do you feel lucky?  ;D
It's not expensive, you just can't afford it.

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #32 on: August 17, 2011, 10:28:21 pm »
Yeah, like Dick Turpin, we have the common decency to wear a mask whilst ripping people off!  ;D

garyj

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #33 on: August 17, 2011, 10:29:46 pm »
Neil............. what is wrong with the following sentence.....

Gary.............. awake................... organise................ ??


Ahhhh, was that you that woke me up Neil   >:(

Seriously, no calls here, I was in as well. 07826710394.

Evening Hector  ;D

creighton foyle

  • Posts: 761
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #34 on: August 17, 2011, 10:31:57 pm »
is he going to the cleaners carnival ? maybe we could have a boxing match ;D

it was not me,

i would name and shame, if its the truth then it can't slanderous and people deserve to know so it does not happen to them.

derek i am just like you  "nosey" :)

John Kelly

  • Posts: 4461
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #35 on: August 17, 2011, 10:47:05 pm »
Be interesting if all the suppliers posted names of who owed them money for months and months and months.

jasonl

  • Posts: 3183
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #36 on: August 17, 2011, 10:54:19 pm »
Ill put my hands up and say I owe £1500 at the moment to 3  separate regular posters on here for jobs , I get paid sometimes a year after a job is complete , as my customer is in a chain up to 5 people deep , I am not making off the jobs ,it is the nature of the business .    I have 21k outstanding from 2008 which I will never see , sometimes this happens , but on balance  we all have winners and losers . No point crying about it , I never supply services that I cannot afford to not get paid for.
I clean carpets
I dry Buildings

spindle

  • Posts: 680
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #37 on: August 17, 2011, 10:58:15 pm »
guys,,

i have always been paid by the "client" having done around 20k of work with them!
payment had always been slow but never a problem. which is why i have not been concerned untill now

i was made aware that the clients client had been slow in paying "his" bill.. that was in march!

 i have sent several emails made several phonecalls\left messages since.. no response. :o.

HELEN i think you are wrong.. everybody would like to know the name of said individual, but i will not name/shame here on an open forum as i am better than that!  :-X

i have never had to but it would appear that i shall have to take the legal route... unfortunatly :(

thanks for your thoughts...



life is one big learning experience!!!!!!!

John Kelly

  • Posts: 4461
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #38 on: August 17, 2011, 11:05:08 pm »
It would be wrong for anyone to name anybody on an open forum like this. Lots of people in this business go through sticky patches especially if their only income is from carpet cleaning. What is anoying is when people totally ignore any contact you try to make. It just makes you think the worst. I know this is usually through embarrasment.
If you owe money and are in difficulty then let the person know rather than just hope it will go away its much easier all round and an agreement can usually be reached.

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #39 on: August 17, 2011, 11:12:56 pm »
Ill put my hands up and say I owe £1500 at the moment to 3  separate regular posters on here for jobs , I get paid sometimes a year after a job is complete , as my customer is in a chain up to 5 people deep , I am not making off the jobs ,it is the nature of the business .    I have 21k outstanding from 2008 which I will never see , sometimes this happens , but on balance  we all have winners and losers . No point crying about it , I never supply services that I cannot afford to not get paid for.
Jason,
Seems a shame you don't make sure you have the money to pay your  subcontractors before giving them work, or did you tell them they'd have to wait forever for their money?

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #40 on: August 17, 2011, 11:34:20 pm »
Ill put my hands up and say I owe £1500 at the moment to 3  separate regular posters on here for jobs , I get paid sometimes a year after a job is complete , as my customer is in a chain up to 5 people deep , I am not making off the jobs ,it is the nature of the business .    I have 21k outstanding from 2008 which I will never see , sometimes this happens , but on balance  we all have winners and losers . No point crying about it , I never supply services that I cannot afford to not get paid for.

Get your hand in your pocket and pay the three you mention what you owe them. I subcontract window cleaning and make around 10-15% on the jobs, but they are always paid within a week of doing the job, I might have to wait 90 days to be paid, and its me that takes the risk of not ever being paid. If your waiting a year to be paid that isnt the subcontractors problem its yours.

I also have accounts with a number of suppliers, I have always paid them within the terms.  I also use a few other suppliers for carpet cleaning supplies and pay upfront by card for whatever I buy.


derek west

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #41 on: August 17, 2011, 11:55:45 pm »
Ill put my hands up and say I owe £1500 at the moment to 3  separate regular posters on here for jobs , I get paid sometimes a year after a job is complete , as my customer is in a chain up to 5 people deep , I am not making off the jobs ,it is the nature of the business .    I have 21k outstanding from 2008 which I will never see , sometimes this happens , but on balance  we all have winners and losers . No point crying about it , I never supply services that I cannot afford to not get paid for.

bang out of order that is, in a previous thread you were telling cozy to come and have a look at the big car you drive, your portfolio of property and the plans you have to build a cleaning place, £1500 therefore should be a drop in the ocean for you, but maybe not for the poor guys who you owe money too. like i said, bang out of order, theres a guy on here that ive worked on many occasion, he has an annoying 14 day policy for paying me, but he always pays bang on the 14th day.

quote
i never supply services that i cannot afford to not get paid for.

i'm not surprised if you have no intention of paying the subcontractors if you don't. for a top guy on here, i'm quite appauled by that statement. but at least your honest enough to come on here and warn us not to do any work for you in the future.

The Carpet Cleaning Pro

  • Posts: 753
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #42 on: August 18, 2011, 12:42:00 am »
Ill put my hands up and say I owe £1500 at the moment to 3  separate regular posters on here for jobs , I get paid sometimes a year after a job is complete , as my customer is in a chain up to 5 people deep , I am not making off the jobs ,it is the nature of the business .    I have 21k outstanding from 2008 which I will never see , sometimes this happens , but on balance  we all have winners and losers . No point crying about it , I never supply services that I cannot afford to not get paid for.

I would like to say that I am one of the 3 to whom Jason owes £600. I would like to say that Jason from passing the work on to me expalined that I would get paid when he gets paid. I accepted this and still do. I understand that the insurance companies pay invoices when they feel like it. Jason has not tried in any way to dodge phone calls and has always kept me in the loop of chasing up calls he has made to companies. I expect to be paid and can say from previous payments from Jason... "that he is a man of his word"

Jim_77

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #43 on: August 18, 2011, 12:56:59 am »
Cheque's in the post I promise!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ;D

The Carpet Cleaning Pro

  • Posts: 753
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #44 on: August 18, 2011, 12:58:54 am »
 ;D ;D

jasonl

  • Posts: 3183
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #45 on: August 18, 2011, 06:09:35 am »
Ill put my hands up and say I owe £1500 at the moment to 3  separate regular posters on here for jobs , I get paid sometimes a year after a job is complete , as my customer is in a chain up to 5 people deep , I am not making off the jobs ,it is the nature of the business .    I have 21k outstanding from 2008 which I will never see , sometimes this happens , but on balance  we all have winners and losers . No point crying about it , I never supply services that I cannot afford to not get paid for.

bang out of order that is, in a previous thread you were telling cozy to come and have a look at the big car you drive, your portfolio of property and the plans you have to build a cleaning place, £1500 therefore should be a drop in the ocean for you, but maybe not for the poor guys who you owe money too. like i said, bang out of order, theres a guy on here that ive worked on many occasion, he has an annoying 14 day policy for paying me, but he always pays bang on the 14th day.

quote
i never supply services that i cannot afford to not get paid for.

i'm not surprised if you have no intention of paying the subcontractors if you don't. for a top guy on here, i'm quite appauled by that statement. but at least your honest enough to come on here and warn us not to do any work for you in the future.


I pay when I get paid , simple as that , sometimes I have paid out of my pocket too, I did not mention that the work I have given out is all in the over £100 /hour bracket .

Yes I have assets , but cash flow is tight in these times , what do you expect me to do ? sell some land which I own outright to pay relatively small cash amounts?

People I owe always get paid .
I clean carpets
I dry Buildings

Helen

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #46 on: August 18, 2011, 07:43:21 am »
guys,,

HELEN i think you are wrong.. everybody would like to know the name of said individual, but i will not name/shame here on an open forum as i am better than that!  :-X

uhhh????
Didn't I first say that whovever is the guilty party should NOT be named on here ???

Mr Dvae

  • Posts: 442
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #47 on: August 18, 2011, 07:47:05 am »
did someone say have to wait?................why? i just quoted 2k for a job, told them 1k upfront or i don't do it. i don't know them so i'm certainly not going to work that hard to poss not get paid the full sum.
If they can't afford to pay they shouldn't order the goods. Simples.
also if someone wants credit you should run a credit check on them, Free i believe if you've got a barclays bank account.

Dave

derek west

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #48 on: August 18, 2011, 07:55:23 am »
quote 1...
i pay when i get paid
quote 2
people i owe always get paid

my question?
how does that work?






Helen

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #49 on: August 18, 2011, 08:03:05 am »
If they can't afford to pay they shouldn't order the goods. Simples.
Dave

In an ideal world yes.

I'm pretty sure that Joe Bloggs builders who do all the leg work, are paid by the contractor on site, who in turn are paid by the main contractor. I'm also pretty sure that the Main Contractor doesn't wait to sell all the site houses until he starts paying out....... the houses would never get built otherwise.

Whoever purchases the work to be done is liable for the payment, not anyone else "up the line".

mike roberts

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #50 on: August 18, 2011, 09:02:23 am »
This is a great topic --- 'late payment' but obviously sorry for the guy awaiting payment!

Simple answer to the debate should u name and shame ... One of the 'Godss'  starts new Post.

PAYMENT ON TIME
...... everyone whos pays on time to 'stated terms' signs up for it!!!
its obviously its a tight forum :)
soon find out who the person is in Q!

Same time why not start a post companies with poor payment record not illegal if it can be proven!


For christ sake keep that Jason away ' I pay when I get paid' if we all worked that way no one would ever be paid - frankly if you work to them terms ur desperate doesnt matter if u work for £200 /hr u dont no when or if ur going to get it :o

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #51 on: August 18, 2011, 09:12:13 am »
Quote
PAYMENT ON TIME...... everyone whos pays on time to 'stated terms' signs up for it!!!
its obviously its a tight forum
soon find out who the person is in Q!

This is just a re-hash of my suggestion.

 ;D

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #52 on: August 18, 2011, 09:41:07 am »

Jason,
If you pay when paid, do you tell your subbies that before giving them work or is that something they find out afterwards?
You say, 'sometimes I have paid out of my pocket too, I did not mention that the work I have given out is all in the over £100 /hour bracket .'
I don't think you realise that you are engaging other people to do YOUR WORK which is your responsibility, not just to get the work done but to make sure the person who did it for you gets paid.
You always have to add a brag element too. 'what do you expect me to do ? sell some land which I own outright to pay relatively small cash amounts?'
In other words, I'm ok, Jack I've got all this land and property (yeah - right) but sod the idiot who did those jobs, he can wait for his money.
Speaking of bragging, you were telling us how much turnover you've done on your way to 1st year £100K, plenty of money to pay your debts then.

But your most astonishing claim yet, that you have to wait up to a year for your money. What is the point in doing a job you have to wait a year to get paid for? I've been in your business, Jason and I know how things work. I don't know which business school you went to but I'd pass their details onto Al Qaeda.

Simon


mike roberts

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #53 on: August 18, 2011, 09:53:31 am »
Quote
PAYMENT ON TIME...... everyone whos pays on time to 'stated terms' signs up for it!!!
its obviously its a tight forum
soon find out who the person is in Q!

This is just a re-hash of my suggestion.

 ;D

No its better and simpler :) :)

AshWhite

  • Posts: 3427
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #54 on: August 18, 2011, 11:50:52 am »
There's obviously 2 sides to this - if Jason has agreed terms with Monty (who, let's not forget, doesn't seem to have any problems with the arrangement) then there really is no issue.

Regardless of how well off Jason is or isn't, or how liquid he is - an arrangement between 2 business people is just that - agreeable on both sides.

Expecting to get paid after a job is completed THEN being told that you have to wait is bang out of order, which is what I'm assuming has happened to the OP.

Nothing worse than someone dodging your calls and burying their head in the sand.

Ash
Carpet Cleaning http://www.floors2show.co.uk
Google Adwords Management http://www.pagecrest.co.uk

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #55 on: August 18, 2011, 12:04:07 pm »
Quote
No its better and simpler

Well actually MY idea is better .................................

and you are simple     ;D

mike roberts

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #56 on: August 18, 2011, 12:09:24 pm »
Quote
No its better and simpler

Well actually MY idea is better .................................

and you are simple     ;D

Nice to know there are women on this site  ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

How about getting back to issue :D

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #57 on: August 18, 2011, 01:11:04 pm »
Talk about having a 'Rattner' moment.
Jason what were you thinking of putting that on this forum?
Your credability rating has just hit ZERO on here. It's one thing builders trying it on with each other for payment but this (carpet cleaning industry) is relatively small and I liked to think we tended to look out and look after each other.
No one gives a jot what the payment terms are further up the chain, it's the end person doing the actual work who wants payment asp for that work carried out. Further up the chain is just paperwork for the sake of paperwork.

The Carpet Cleaning Pro

  • Posts: 753
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #58 on: August 18, 2011, 02:18:00 pm »
How many of you buy houses and have car/van finance. Well that's an agreement and you hopefully stick to it. Well Jason and I have an agreement and Jason has stuck to it. So guys.......... what is the problem. The people who are moaning about people owed money know thier own financial situation and should make sure that they get paid on what ever terms they set up. If terms are broken, then use the legal system. "I have no problems with anyone and thier own views... especially Jason who has become a good source of work and helpfull advice. I have had some very big jobs, (10-15k) but without Jasons knowledge and imput would not have had. Whats more ... out of the industry I consider Jason to be a good friend.

richy27

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #59 on: August 18, 2011, 03:38:08 pm »
if someone enters into an agreement to do some sub work for another cc and is fully aware that they will not be paid until they are paid then thats fair enough.

if this is not explained before work commences then its a bit naughty .

personally for work i have sub ed out in the past i have always paid my contractors before i get paid as i believe it to be two separate agreements . 

to put it in blunt terms they are working for me  and i am working for whoever pays me.

mind you i have not sub ed out 10 k jobs only small amounts as i am a greedy poope and like all the money to myself

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #60 on: August 18, 2011, 07:23:39 pm »
Isn't this 'pay when paid' malarky just a licence to take endless credit from the gullible? And then keep fobbing them off with, 'oh, I haven't been paid yet.' Rubbish, it's a mugs game to agree to pay when paid, especially in carpet cleaning. At most you could give 28 days credit but that is it.
What happens if the customer goes bust and never pays? You've agreed to pay when when so you've lost out too.
It's a mugs game!!!!

Simon

The Great One

  • Posts: 11802
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #61 on: August 18, 2011, 07:43:47 pm »
Isn't this 'pay when paid' malarky just a licence to take endless credit from the gullible? And then keep fobbing them off with, 'oh, I haven't been paid yet.' Rubbish, it's a mugs game to agree to pay when paid, especially in carpet cleaning. At most you could give 28 days credit but that is it.
What happens if the customer goes bust and never pays? You've agreed to pay when when so you've lost out too.
It's a mugs game!!!!

Simon


You've answered your own question, no one gets paid!

What if the person subbing the work has loads of invoices outstanding and hasn't the cash flow at the time to pay the subbee, he has to wait for payment to come in, then what if that persons own debts come in as the money hits the account.

We could of course go on for ages, if both parties agree to the terms then that's it and no one can really comment as both parties have made their own agreement which they are both happy to operate under.

End of chat

Martin 8)

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #62 on: August 18, 2011, 08:02:54 pm »
There is also an element of duress, although not deliberate, but when you're hard up looking for work and someone offers you some good work, you'll agree to it simply because it's a choice between earning and doing nothing.
Simon

Colin Day

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #63 on: August 18, 2011, 08:12:21 pm »
There is also an element of duress, although not deliberate, but when you're hard up looking for work and someone offers you some good work, you'll agree to it simply because it's a choice between earning and doing nothing.
Simon

Greed and desperation catches a lot of people out. If someone offered me a £10k job, I'd want (like someone already said) half up front. The first thing I was ever told when I was starting a business was, trust nobody.

Obviously there are exceptions to these rules, but if something sounds too good to be true..... you know the rest....

Glynn

  • Posts: 1129
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #64 on: August 18, 2011, 08:20:49 pm »
Jason are you still running your vehicle on used cooking oil to save money ?.
Regards
Glynn

clinton

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #65 on: August 18, 2011, 08:21:17 pm »
Same as colin said as would want to even work for a payment in a years time..

The Carpet Cleaning Pro

  • Posts: 753
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #66 on: August 18, 2011, 08:37:30 pm »
May I just clear something up please. Jason did not sub me a 10K job. The 10K job was mine but asked Jason to share his knowledge from his vast experience. I think without the Knowledge I gained from his experience I would have got the job.

Also the money owed is from a flood cleanup I did in Sheffield for him as he was unable to attend. The total for the job was £1910.00 and agreement was... I get paid when he gets paid from insurance company. Jason has infact recently paid me £1300 of the invoice as he had monies from another job, however the insurance company from the invoiced job had still not paid for works carried out.

Jon Tabbener

  • Posts: 152
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #67 on: August 18, 2011, 08:42:27 pm »
I dont see what the problem is if everyone knows whats happening.

I do quite a bit of work with another forum member & i know that i will get paid when he gets paid, by reading most of the above maybe i'm a mug for accepting these terms - i don't think so, as we are good friends now all through carpet cleaning & working together
Cleaner Carpets

Ian Gourlay

  • Posts: 5748
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #68 on: August 18, 2011, 09:26:49 pm »
It is avery dangerous game to owe people money

Even if you have assets you can be made bankrupt  used to be £750 for someone to start proceedings

 If you owe an Insurance Company Money they come down like a ton a bricks, legal action threat fast etc etc
If money is outstanding from 2008 why not take action


Jamie Pearson

  • Posts: 3407
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #69 on: August 18, 2011, 10:31:08 pm »
Be interesting if all the suppliers posted names of who owed them money for months and months and months.

 Best not.

John Kelly

  • Posts: 4461
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #70 on: August 18, 2011, 10:40:25 pm »
You lot want to get involved in the fire & flood industry.Sometimes in excess of 12 months to get paid. Not really a worry on a 6k job I'll wait 12 months.

Added by Ian Gourlay

John I fail to understand why you have to wait 12 months . If the work is done The Insurance Company should pay

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #71 on: August 18, 2011, 11:21:29 pm »
Like I said, it's a mugs game - play it for long enough and in due course you'll find out why it is a game for mugs!

Simon

The Great One

  • Posts: 11802
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #72 on: August 19, 2011, 08:46:45 am »
There is also an element of duress, although not deliberate, but when you're hard up looking for work and someone offers you some good work, you'll agree to it simply because it's a choice between earning and doing nothing.
Simon

Greed and desperation catches a lot of people out. If someone offered me a £10k job, I'd want (like someone already said) half up front. The first thing I was ever told when I was starting a business was, trust nobody.

Obviously there are exceptions to these rules, but if something sounds too good to be true..... you know the rest....

Hi Colin

So you would want £5000 up front, do you yourself have £5000 sitting around to hand to someone?

Hands up who has £5000 spare sitting in a account just in case they get a £10,000 job in?

I myself have taken cash upfront on painting jobs to cover materials etc, but also work the other way and get paid when they get paid.

It is whatever both parties agree, as long as they are both happy, that's it.

Martin 8)

derek west

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #73 on: August 19, 2011, 11:14:17 am »
i think everyone is missing the point on this debate.

i myself would take on the odd job where i get paid when the contractor gets paid. but i would not do it if the contractor openly admitted that he occasionally doesn't get paid for years and sometimes doesn't get paid full stop, and on top of that he's not really bothered as he can afford not to get paid.

Ian Gourlay

  • Posts: 5748
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #74 on: August 19, 2011, 11:38:02 am »
I understand  Houses need to be dried out etc Builders need to move  in  and maybee insurance Companies do not pay until last job is finished.

May bee its the way the industry works but it is wrong

When One Trade Ie the Water remover has finished he should get paid in my opinion and if the main contractor is willing to work like this he should have working capital to cover stage payments or take out a bank loan.

When I was a retailer I had to pay for my stock in a month I could not say I will pay you when I sell it in3 months or a years time if it was a slow moving item

wynne jones

  • Posts: 2918
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #75 on: August 19, 2011, 12:11:27 pm »
They drag out payment because... they can.
It's not expensive, you just can't afford it.

jasonl

  • Posts: 3183
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #76 on: August 19, 2011, 02:59:37 pm »
i think everyone is missing the point on this debate.

i myself would take on the odd job where i get paid when the contractor gets paid. but i would not do it if the contractor openly admitted that he occasionally doesn't get paid for years and sometimes doesn't get paid full stop, and on top of that he's not really bothered as he can afford not to get paid.

I did a 700 quid flood very near to you on Tuesday , it cost me £100 in fuel and materials  zero ad costs .

I will not be paid until December , according to you I am daft for doing this work , according to me I am building a business .
I clean carpets
I dry Buildings

gwrightson

  • Posts: 3617
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #77 on: August 19, 2011, 03:23:33 pm »

I have always offered a !05 discount on early payment with commercial jobs, i have now started asking them.
Will it be payment upon completion? Why ?
Then i can clean at a reduced price, 2 commercal jobs this last 2 weeks, both paid upon completion because of the offer, and before any body says large companys dont work this way, youre wrong. One was for Easy Jet.and another for an global medical company.
Getting to the point of money owing. IT WASNT ME!!!
geoff
who ever said dont knock before u try ,i never tried dog crap but i know i wouldnt like  haha

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #78 on: August 19, 2011, 04:37:00 pm »
I did a 700 quid flood very near to you on Tuesday , it cost me £100 in fuel and materials  zero ad costs .
I will not be paid until December , according to you I am daft for doing this work , according to me I am building a business .

So if you had subbed that job out would you have told the subbie he would get paid at the end of the job, end of the month, 60 days or when you get paid?

Your agreement with the insurance company has no relevance if there is someone else doing the actual work. I know I wouldn't take on subbie work waiting till December for my money because there could be too many people in the chain which could be broken if one of them went bust. On the other hand if there is only the insurance company and the person doing the work then that is different. Insurance companies rarely go bust (or is underwritten by someone else anyway), contractors go bust every week for either genuine money reasons or just pulling a fast one to get away from paying their bills.

derek west

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #79 on: August 19, 2011, 04:37:44 pm »
i think everyone is missing the point on this debate.

i myself would take on the odd job where i get paid when the contractor gets paid. but i would not do it if the contractor openly admitted that he occasionally doesn't get paid for years and sometimes doesn't get paid full stop, and on top of that he's not really bothered as he can afford not to get paid.

I did a 700 quid flood very near to you on Tuesday , it cost me £100 in fuel and materials  zero ad costs .

I will not be paid until December , according to you I am daft for doing this work , according to me I am building a business .

how dya get that from my post. like i said, and i'm repeating my self here. i "WOULD" do the job and wait for payment. but i "WOULDN'T if the payer was laxidasicle when collecting the money. because he was rich enough to not get paid. you obviously don't understand my point so i'll leave it there.

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #80 on: August 19, 2011, 04:47:15 pm »

hi guys

i did a job in january for a well known member of this forum.. the bill was around £800. i have spent the last few months chasing/calling him... my calls are not being returned.

i have been quite reasonable and patient but now its not funny... its been 8MONTHS

i dont know how  to continue pursuing this issue...

i hope by posting here it may put a rocket up his a$$.... you know who u are!!!!



we all seem to have drifted off the original point here, Spindle did a job for a member of this forum and said member had been ignoring him to the tune of 8 months............

I would name the said member and then take him to court..........

you cannot be sued for libel if the statement is the truth.....

how would you feel if you did not name him and one of us did some work and did not get paid, and you could have prevented it.....

Mike Halliday

  • Posts: 11581
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #81 on: August 19, 2011, 04:58:53 pm »
hector, he has already said he will not name the person on any forum, which begs the questions..... why start the topic in the first place?,

quote: 'i hope by posting here it may put a rocket up his a$$'..... yep that rocket is well inserted ;)

now threaten to name him and you can light the touchpaper
Mike Halliday.  www.henryhalliday.co.uk

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #82 on: August 19, 2011, 07:05:18 pm »
 ;D ;D

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #83 on: August 19, 2011, 07:19:01 pm »
There seems to be an astonishing level of loyalty displayed towards someone who has ripped off a fellow member to the tune of £800. He clearly doesn't value his credibility otherwise he would have been in touch with spindle to come to some arrangement and remove the risk of him being name and shamed.

Tony Rowley

  • Posts: 257
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #84 on: August 19, 2011, 08:04:03 pm »
I know this is off the topic (as is a lot of stuff on this thread) but, and i dont think all the critisism levelled at Jasonl is justified, but why the hell would someone who can basically write off £21k of unpaid invoices in a year be in a situation where they think doing a Groupon deal would be a goer, not that im shooting the idea to pieces it just strikes me as a bit odd. And the fact that he can let that money go would make me very wary to work for him on a "i'll pay you when i get payed" basis, given on the information he may never get payed!!!!

I would say that from my point of view the longer you wait for payment the less the money is worth.

IMO the person involved should be named and shamed to stop anyone else being stitched.

Tony

Glynn

  • Posts: 1129
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #85 on: August 19, 2011, 08:15:29 pm »
I agree, name n shame.

Someone start a new topic " who it isn't ".
Regards
Glynn

Simon Gerrard

  • Posts: 4405
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #86 on: August 19, 2011, 08:51:33 pm »
I know this is off the topic (as is a lot of stuff on this thread) but, and i dont think all the critisism levelled at Jasonl is justified, but why the hell would someone who can basically write off £21k of unpaid invoices in a year be in a situation where they think doing a Groupon deal would be a goer, not that im shooting the idea to pieces it just strikes me as a bit odd. And the fact that he can let that money go would make me very wary to work for him on a "i'll pay you when i get payed" basis, given on the information he may never get payed!!!!

I would say that from my point of view the longer you wait for payment the less the money is worth.

And if he can let £21k go why can't he pay the the £1,500 he owes other members.
As for group on.............. ;D
IMO the person involved should be named and shamed to stop anyone else being stitched.

Tony

Matt Lindus

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #87 on: August 23, 2011, 08:19:01 pm »
These are big sums for carpet cleaners. I thought you were all £50 job men.

Clare.w

  • Posts: 88
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #88 on: August 23, 2011, 08:26:29 pm »
That's what I thought! I got all excited about how much we could earn!! ;D

Helen

Re: chasing payment
« Reply #89 on: August 24, 2011, 07:51:21 am »
These are big sums for carpet cleaners. I thought you were all £50 job men.
It's not just carpet cleaning :)

Len Gribble

  • Posts: 5106
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #90 on: August 28, 2011, 07:05:15 pm »
Chris

Have you received payment? Or a promise
Always bear in mind that your own resolution to succeed is more important than any other. (Sidcup Kent)

jasonl

  • Posts: 3183
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #91 on: August 30, 2011, 02:24:29 pm »
Its not me by the way ;D

I keep in contact with the people I sub work to , and have had the arrangement in place for several years in some cases.

If people do not wish to do they work they can always say no.

I am not sat on a pile of cash while withholding payments , I pay when paid , it is a simple  concept , and the only downside of doing the more lucrative commercial disaster restoration work with long supply chains .

Sorry if anyone is offended by this .
I clean carpets
I dry Buildings

Ian Gourlay

  • Posts: 5748
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #92 on: August 30, 2011, 10:56:12 pm »
Did you watch last weeks Undercover Boss USA . It was about the boss of Bafour? The worlds largest disaster restoration company forgoing his executive jet and going under cover.

It makes you appreciate how complex this work is

wynne jones

  • Posts: 2918
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #93 on: August 30, 2011, 11:20:27 pm »
I saw it Ian, was channel hopping and saw some old guy crying and taking off a wig in front of a butch female with a truckmount. They were treating them like dogs, but that's employment for you.
It's not expensive, you just can't afford it.

spindle

  • Posts: 680
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #94 on: October 29, 2011, 10:47:21 pm »
Just an update .. The said member has been in touch.... Told me they would sort something out by end of September .... Well it's now nearly end of October ... And NOTHING!!!



life is one big learning experience!!!!!!!

Tony Rowley

  • Posts: 257
Re: chasing payment
« Reply #95 on: October 30, 2011, 12:01:32 am »
The person involved obviously does not give a rats arse and you  should out him because he is making you look like a mug!

Tony