Carpet Cleaning Issues - Carpet construction, upholstery cleaning, stain removal, equipment, events, etc.
Your cleaning solutions
Posted by carpet_bright (carpet_bright), 21 January 2004With all the different chemicals and manufacturers that are now available, what are your preferred products that you use for HWE carpet cleaning.
I mostly use Prochem multipro then extraction pro for mine ( with added odour fresh for that lovely fragrance!)
I am interested in trying other products and would love to hear what's hot and what's not
Posted by paul_moss (paul_moss), 21 January 2004Paul
I also use prochem products and have found them good.However reading some of the links on micro splitting chemicals I think I might give them a try out as they sound better and more cost affective.
Posted by Appleton_Cleaning (Bill Appleton), 23 January 2004Micro-splitting chemicals? wossat then?
Posted by Mike_Boxall (Mike_Boxall), 23 January 2004Hi Bill
Micro-splitting chemicals are getting more and more popular with professional carpet cleaners mainly becuase they contain no detergents which can cause resoiling (depending who you talk to ). They are also simple to use because you just prespray the carpet with them and use a freshwater rinse. They cut down the number of chemicals you need to use although there are still products you need to consider from the likes of Prochem.
The 2 main brands are One-Step and Solution UK who both have representatives who contribute to this forum. I'm sure one of them will volunteer more technical info for you.
Posted by Mr._One_Step (Steve Carpenter), 23 January 2004The term "Micro-splitting" was developed by Ed Crawford the inventor of One Step products to describe how his unique product works.
One Step ‘Microsplitting’! Unlike detergents and enzymatic products that are designed to penetrate and emulsify soil in order to suspend it for removal, One Step shatters the bond that holds soils to fibres at a micro-molecular level. Once this bond has been broken the remaining soil particles can easily be removed with your chosen carpet or upholstery cleaning system. It even removes the thick black protein based soiling that’s found on pub, restaurant and nightclub carpeting. It also removes residues from detergent based cleaning chemicals.
One Step is suitable for use with all carpet, upholstery, ceiling, wall & floor cleaning systems including dry compound, bonnet, rotary, oscillating pad machines, hot water extraction either with portables or truck mounted carpet cleaning systems. It is clear, odourless, non-foaming, non re-soiling and doesn’t contain potentially harmful detergents, bacteria, oxidising/reducing agents, enzymes or optical colour brighteners.
Its an environmentally sound cleaning range that is highly effective and safe for you, your customers and the environment. So safe in fact that it is hypoallergenic as it is made from natural food based derivatives It was introduced into the European market after successful trials and promptly won an innovative new product award at the Europropre Tradeshow, Paris in March 1997.
Its available from Amtech UK and their selected distributors.
Posted by allencarpetclean (allencarpetclean), 23 January 2004Did you copy that Steve or did it just roll straight off your tongue?
Posted by Mr._One_Step (Steve Carpenter), 23 January 2004Hi Bob,
You know me better than that!!!
Posted by stevegunn (Steve Gunn), 23 January 2004Give Solution (Nick) a ring 08701123691 their product is great.I have used Solution no 2 on carpets that in the past i would have walked away from they were that bad but came up like new.Also tried their stainless steel cleaner,laminate floor cleaner and the tile cleaner its outstanding.
Posted by lenpg (Len Gribble), 23 January 2004
Being an ardent user of Prochem/Chemspec products one now has to look, at cost savings, within our industry, what dose the same job at a lower cost to you!!
I’m not in to the tech stuff that’s for the scientists and the reps (and their BS) trying it is the only way.
Having only used one step yesterday (been on the shelf for 3 months) I was impressed with the result, dwell time I left it a bit longer then normal, perhaps that me, (a new agent being cautious) I will be trying this out tomorrow at less a dwell time against Prochem/Chemspec products, will let you know.
Posted by Mr._One_Step (Steve Carpenter), 24 January 2004Hi Len,
One Step works in an entirely different way than detergent based products. When you use a detergent and apply your traffic lane cleaner or pre-conditioner to the carpet you will see the carpet become visually cleaner. This is the detergent breaking down the bond and emulsifying and lifting soil. Agitation further increases this action and finally you rinse until the carpet is clean.
The ‘Micro-Splitting’ process works on contact dispersing dirt. This is because the soil bond has been shattered. If you apply One Step through your pressure sprayer and place the spray nozzle a few centimetres above the carpet and spray you will see the soil move and the carpet become clean. Now as its not practical to clean in this way or cost effective so we recommend using One Step as follows:
How to use One Step products:
1. Pre-test the fibres or fabric for colourfastness with One Step diluted as per the container instructions to ensure suitability for use.
2. Vacuum the carpet or upholstery with a commercial grade vacuum upright such as the Sebo BS36/BS46 or a suitable carpet pile lifter vacuum.
3. Dilute One Step concentrates with either hot or cold water from between 1:5 to 1:16 depending on soil conditions.
4. Apply by either a hand pump-up sprayer or electric sprayer fitted with an ‘8002’ T-Jet fan type spray nozzle for carpet application and ‘6501’ T-Jet fan type nozzle for upholstery application. An in-line sprayer can also be used with truck mounts. In this case change the standard ‘6505’ T-Jet nozzle to a ‘8003’ T-Jet nozzle and calibrate the 5 quart draw container to apply from between 1:5 or 1:16 Contact Amtech UK for further details.
5. Use One Step Carpet & Upholstery Cleaner (pH 9.4) for synthetic fibres and One Step ‘Fineline’ (pH 6.5) for wool or natural fibres.
6. Apply a fine mist approximately 12” from the surface at walking pace in both directions overlapping to ensure even product coverage.
7. Agitate by hand with a pile brush or mechanically with a low speed rotary, OP machine or preferably a contra-rotating brush machine for carpets. Use sponges, terry towelling, or natural and synthetic hand brushes for upholstery.
8. Using an extraction machine rinse with plain fresh hot water only. It is not necessary to add detergents or acid rinses* to your solution tank. One Step is free rinsing with water. (*Unless dye stability issues are a problem and it can be corrected with the use of a suitable acid rinse).
9. Post treat any difficult to remove spots and stains that may remain with either of our concentrates mixed at 1:2 or our Zip-IT and Zap-IT spotters.
Zap-IT contains a small amount of solvent to speed up the removal of diverse spots and stains such as gum, tape residue, grease, oil, tar, asphalt, wax, crayon, latex paints, lipstick, mascara, shoe polish etc. Please note that this is the only product within the One Step range that is required by law to have a hazard-warning label displayed.
I hope this helps.
Posted by cleaning (cleaning), 24 January 2004Steve,
If One Step contains no detergents, is it OK to tip the contents of the recovery tank into the storm drain.
Posted by Les (Les), 24 January 2004I tried a product called Easi-Step instead of the Prochem range as a test for a local supplier. I a) didn't find the results to be as good and b) It worked out to be much more expensive.
That said I'm keen to hear more about the products mentioned above, 'open mind' an all that.
Can someone please mail me some info and prices?
Posted by nick.solution (nick.solution), 24 January 2004Hi All
Steves Instructions for use of micro spliiters Book brill
nice one Steve
Chapter 2!! microsplitting chemical usage, less is best don't overwet the surface to be cleaned, agitation will speed up the soil particle break down.
Nice short chapter for busy carpet cleaners
Interestingly Solution won First Prize at Europre inovation awards 2003 and was the first micro splitting chemical to be Woolsafe registered both products were demonstrated by Guenter Gloeckner.
Posted by lenpg (Len Gribble), 24 January 2004
Thanks for the info, unfortunately unable test the product today police closed the road and access, but doing a wool black and white rug tomorrow (at home clearing up back log on rugs), which has urine on it a year old (bitches) any recommendations with this product also what it like on pub carpet which are heavily soiled?
What do you pay of One Step? I think my Jan supplier was a bit dear £18 4lt.
Posted by Appleton_Cleaning (Bill Appleton), 24 January 2004Cheers muchly Mike, Steve & co.will certainly be giving Nick a ring as we are a bit tree-huggish here and always happy to hear about eco-friendly solutions
Posted by Mr._One_Step (Steve Carpenter), 24 January 2004Hi Len,
Rather than feed you BS I would like to explain that up until 3 years ago I too was sceptical of the claims of the ‘Micro-Splitting’ cleaning solutions until I tried them. Like you I had used Prochems products (since 1989) and then Chemspec products from 1992. When One Step was first introduced into the UK in 1997 like many others I dismissed its claims and ignored it as a viable cleaning product. What a mistake to make!!!
It is the closest product I have ever used that does all!!!
I even had a demonstration of the product and was still not impressed. However I was supplied a usable sample and allowed to experiment. Using standard cleaning practices laid down by the NCCA, IICRC, and the WoolSafe organisation I began to experiment with One Step and replaced the traffic lane cleaners and detergent and acid rinses with One Step and fresh water rinsing. The results have been out standing and I would not go back to cleaning with detergents even if they were free. Soil removal is superior, most spots and stains respond to treatment with either of the concentrates diluted accordingly or with the specific spotters. Customers are now aware of the issues of hazardous cleaning products that are in daily use and love the results that are achievable with One Step and the fact that its totally safe to use.
This is a point I raised with Paul Bakker of the WoolSafe Organisation when One Step ‘Fineline’ was given its Woolsafe approval in 2001. All products are tested and have to be safe for use on wool without causing damage to the wool fibre. Whilst this may be the case many WoolSafe products contain potentially harmful compounds that are considered by international regulatory agencies to be detrimental to your health and harmful to the environment. This is an area, which I feel needs more support and research by trade associations, testing houses and government bodies to satisfy the concerns of cleaners and consumers.
Moving back to your question Len I clean Oriental and Persian rugs using One Step ‘Fineline’ a WoolSafe approved carpet and upholstery cleaner (pH 6.5) and recommend cleaning as follows:
Test the rug for suitability for cleaning i.e. colourfastness, tuft & dimensional stability, damage etc. If it will withstand the use of a pile lifter vacuum and wet cleaning then place the rug face down on an oversized plastic sheet that will encompass the fringe as well. Vacuum the back with the pile lifter or commercial upright vacuum with cylindrical brush agitation to release dust then lift the rug back and vacuum or sweep the dust away and repeat. Then place the rug on its back and vacuum.
Mix One Step 'Fineline' at 1:5 with water and mist onto the rug (testing for colour migration first) via a pump up pressure sprayer fitted with an 8001 T-Jet nozzle. Apply lightly north to south, east to west and agitate with a contra rotating brush machine or by hand. Rinse the carpet with an upholstery hand tool using 1-2 rinse passes, this should be sufficient to remove even the heaviest of soiling. If dye stability issues are a problem and it can be corrected with the use of a suitable acid rinse then add it to your solution tank. If this is still a problem then clean with a dry compound cleaner such as One Step ‘Express’.
For the fringe One Step 'Fineline' can be mixed from 1:1 depending on soiling and staining. Spray onto the fringe and brush away from the rug, finally rinse and make additional drying passes until most of the moisture has been extracted. If the fringe has stains or has browned then post spray with a 5% solution of acetic acid (white vinegar) and dry extract-this will remove browning and lighten the fringe without causing damage. Finally speed dry the rug using air movers.
You mentioned a urine problem on the rug. If it is wool it will have caused permanent damage to the fibre and also colour loss. You should bring this to your customer’s attention. Treat the odour problem with a specific urine odour treatment and clean both the face fibres and backing in the area affected.
Another question raised was whether wastewater containing One Step residues could be disposed of down a storm drain. Although One Step is an environmentally sound cleaning solution and biodegradable the answer is No. All wastewater must be flushed down the toilet.
There are about 4 other “Micro-splitting” cleaning solutions (and more on the way) currently available in the UK allegedly based on One Step. These are sold with varying pricing structures, some directly and some through distributors as with One Step products.
Its different but it works!!!
Posted by Ivar_Haglund (Ivar_Haglund), 25 January 2004D2o
I have gone nuclear
Posted by lenpg (Len Gribble), 25 January 2004
Thanks again very informative
Posted by ALEXDH (ALEXDH), 25 January 2004hi gents
Am i right in thinking alot of you chaps are moving away from ultimate master, i was under the impression a lot of you chaps used this.
I also use chemspec one clean traffic lane cleaner and powder diluted in the tank. of my ninja.
Am i out of date already.
I have to admit i do use my powerbrush more than i thought i would nowdays.
Posted by ALEXDH (ALEXDH), 25 January 2004ps, i use the one clean on wools.
i understand ultimate master is not woolsafe.
Posted by MB (Mark Betts), 25 January 2004Alex
Use whatever chemical you are A; Comfortable with. and B: Can get hold of easily.
There are that many different chemicals around these days its confusing.
When i started i jumped from this chemical to that chemical etc etc and to be honest I couldnt see much of a difference between any on them.
At the end of the day the aim is to get the carpets as clean as possible.
I use Ultimate Master exclusively.
The only thing i change is my pre spray.
Medium soiling pre spray from machine with ultimate master.
Heavy soiling Use wools safe pre spray or heavy duty if minging and carpet lknackered anyway.
Allrtec Fabric Pre wash and rinse with U/M in tank.
If dodgy fabric as above but with Acid Rinse.
Pre spray Enzyme.
Ectract off with Ultimate master.
Posted by Lionel (Lionel), 27 January 2004Len
Steve Carpenter forget to mention that he use to work for Chemspec and now works for One Step. Dont believe the hype.
Posted by Derek (Derek Bolton), 27 January 2004Hi Lionel
Steve also runs his own cleaning business near to me... you could say we are competitors... I always let his van tyres down whenever I pass it in my area
Only kidding....I have known Steve, his brother David who also runs a carpet cleaning company in the Milton Keynes area also his father for years.
Steve has a vast wealth of experience at his disposal and his promotion of One-Step and CFR is based on his own experiences within the industry.
After all..aren't we are all talking about (and indirectly promoting) our favourite chemicals and machinery from whichever source all the time.
There are quite a few of us who post here who are concerned about using safe chemicals...safe for the item we are cleaning, safe for the customer and safe for us to use... and rightly so
These issues have not always been in the spotlight as much as they are these days
Posted by carpetmonsters (carpetmonsters), 27 January 2004hi lionel
i first tried one step many years ago but it did not work.
some time later steve carpenter gave me a call and asked if i have tried the product i said yes but it did not work. i was told to try it again and this time it did ( the product had been modified ) and have been useing it ever since. steve carpenter promoted this product to me with no benifit to himself was not and still is not working for onestep. steve has helped me in the past and i trust what he says and has shown me how to clean carpets the correct way.
Posted by Dave_Parry (Dave Parry), 27 January 2004I like the idea of One-step, but as a major part of my work is domestic not sure of the logistics. I believe you have to agitate to get the best results, I dont posses a machine capable of doing this so would have to use a pile brush. What about when you have furniture to move, this would involve pre spraying a part of the carpet, brushing, rinsing, moving the furniture round, pre spraying brushing rinsing etc. It just seems like a lot of extra work to me, but may (Probably) be wrong.
Posted by Derek (Derek Bolton), 28 January 2004Hi Dave
Most of my work is domestic and I operate the vacuum, pretreat, agitate and rinse procedures...not forgetting the final grooming of course.
I also use a micro-splitting chemical as a pretreatment.. it works for me very well.
Move the furniture to the centre clean the edges/sides, replace furniture making sure you pad and block then do the central areas...easy peasy.
Its the only way to do it...unless of course you take ALL the furniture out of the room first, clean the carpet then replace furniture either immediately or go back the folllowing day.. I know of cleaners who actually do it that way.
Posted by Dave_Parry (Dave Parry), 28 January 2004Hi Derek, what method do you use to agitate, Brush or mechanical means. Just about to get my T/M and dont think I will have enough room for another m/c.
Posted by Dynafoam (Dynafoam), 28 January 2004Dave,
I find the old-type Host machine (without vac) excellent for brushing-in and pile-lifting at the same time.
With the handle removed it takes up so little space you could almost put it under the drivers seat !
Posted by Dave_Parry (Dave Parry), 28 January 2004Ta John, Looks Like I'll have to look out for a s/h host before I give micro splitters a try.
Posted by Derek (Derek Bolton), 29 January 2004Hi Dave
John took the words right off of my PC
Posted by squeaky (squeaky), 29 January 2004I have always used craftex/prochem products but I am always interested in something different.
I spoke to Nick at Solutions a couple of days ago and he has recommended that I try Solutions No 2I willpick some up next week and give it a go .
Watch this space
Posted by Lionel (Lionel), 29 January 2004Its a shame that this board has become like Cleantalk, One Step this One Step that, Steve Carpenter, Derek Bolton you both promote this product, you both give seminars and training in the product.This Board is nothing more than biased advertising, you dont see Chemspec or other reps flaunting their gear on this board. It makes me sick.
Posted by Derek (Derek Bolton), 29 January 2004Hi Lionel
Sorry 'old son' but you couldn't be more wrong...
I always try to be generic (not possible everytime when a direct question is asked of me) and I refered to micro -splitting chemicals in my last posts.. which one I was referring to you will have to guess.
The only time I have ever been at a seminar when a micro-splitter chemical was promoted was for a Company in the South when I was asked to do a specific presention on 'problem fabrics' which I did.... the company hosting the day was a Prochem distributor.
I have undertaken training courses/seminars over the years for various organisations and the only product I have ever promoted was 3M's Scotchgard...I was training applicators/retailers at the time....which I think is fair.
Both this Forum and Cleantalk are excellent communication centres for carpet and upholstery cleaners...and yes, whenever carpet cleaners meet we talk clean carpets and that includes chemicals and machines...
I won't apologise for myself or anyone else for that.
On the contrary I think it is healthy for the industry.
I buy and use Prochem chemicals, Chemspec chemicals plus some chemicals from other sources. You will note in my posts that I have admitted to having several different makes of machines.
I am not promoting them merely answering questions or trying to help someone...since when has that been a cardinal sin?
Posted by Mike_Boxall (Mike_Boxall), 29 January 2004on 01/29/04 at 11:03:54, Lionel wrote:
Its a shame that this board has become like Cleantalk, One Step this One Step that, Steve Carpenter, Derek Bolton you both promote this product, you both give seminars and training in the product.This Board is nothing more than biased advertising, you dont see Chemspec or other reps flaunting their gear on this board. It makes me sick.
So what's the answer?
This type of comment / argument is cropping up more and more and will continue to do so as long as we keep getting more members with differing and/or strong opinions.
Steve Carpenter is an extremely experienced cc and has given a lot of good unbiased advice in the past (although lately he does only tend to get involved in the CFR / One Step topics )
Derek's opinion on the other hand I do believe is unbiased and most members, if not all, respect it.
Perhaps I can just remind you that he spends a great deal of his time giving both general and technical advice, which is what most people use this forum for.
If you have suggestions on how we can improve this site please feel free to let us know. We're all keen to improve it whilst not offending all those who are genuinely prepared to take time out to help others.
Posted by mike_halliday (mike_halliday), 29 January 2004I went to the doctors yesturday and told him everytime i eat red peppers it makes me feel sick
guess what he told me? don't eat red peppers!!
So Lionel if these boards are making you sick, thingy off
Posted by mickeyfat (mickeyfat), 29 January 2004you cant even have them on pizza's
you poor poor man
Posted by Tony_Browning (Tony_Browning), 29 January 2004here,here mike
Posted by lenpg (Len Gribble), 29 January 2004
Sorry but I must agree with Derek, Mike B & Mike H on your issue. Why aren’t you having a go at say Host, Dry Fusion, Bane, Ashby, T/M or any other cleaning systems on these forums?
Me carpet T/M T/M T/M, portable upholstery. Cleaning agents XL & multi pro, portable fab presrpay/restorer & f&f rinse. You only have to look at Chemspec or prochem’s sales brochures to see the array of general cleaning agents, and I’ve been though them all, the mind boggles what do I use, so what’s wrong in standardising into one or two agent if they work? I’m running tests on my own & families carpets/upholstery to see what I (keep an open mind) think is the best and not the sales rep or agent manufacture recommendations, I’m not in the pocket of any manufacture and never will be!
Chemspec & Prochem must know of the cc forums so why aren’t they promoting their products? (Good as they are, there is always something new around the block) Complacency rings a bell with me or draw you own conclusions.
Correct me if I’m wrong, don’t you advertise that you are the best cc in town, prove it!!
The only criticism I have with this forum is some members do not give their correct or full details LIKE YOU!! (I wish all would come clean)
This will be probably the last post on this matter I’m always late, work you know 24/5.5
Have a prosperous year all.
Posted by Ken_Wainwright (Ken Wainwright), 30 January 2004So how old are you Len? Where about in the South East do you come from?
Safe and happy cleaning
Posted by lenpg (Len Gribble), 30 January 2004
Thanks for asking and reminding me. I have just updated my forum details age and location, not a problem.
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